Possible New PvP Server- Post Your Feedback!

[Lane]

Image/Devnoob are taking ideas for a possible restart/new based PvP server.


http://www.eqpvp.com/index.php/topic...cseen.html#new


Teams PvP vs FFA?

Item Loot- yes or no?

Pros and Cons of both servers?

Would be great to see feedback either here or on eqpvp.com!

[Maze_EQ]

Full loot(except bags ofc)

No level range between

K/D leaderboard

max level 50

Do it or sthu

[Tabasco]

When I first started tinkering with emu I was going to try a pvp server that could possibly refresh the attitude that you used to be able to find on Tallon Zek. Early on a lot of people had a role-played attitude about it and the server was basically PvE with real accountability.

The idea might not fit what you're wanting to do, but I'll share it because I would love to see it realized, especially by people with experience handling the issues that come with PvP servers.

Basically everyone starts out on the same team, Harmony, or whatever you want to call it.
Once you get a certain amount of people the server picks one at random and presents a popup trying to entice them to Discord. (That's where Discordant Whisper came from, which ended up being pure PvE)
You would probably need to tweak the ratio, but the idea is to maintain a pool of outlaws. I was thinking 1 in 10, but it really depends on your total population.

You could be grouped up with someone and they could suddenly be able to attack you, assuming they decide to go rogue. I figured I would announce the killer and the killed so that people are compelled to start tracking them.
The idea is to get as many kills as you can before you are taken down, or even group up with other discordants if possible. You could set up leaderboards based on longest time alive, longest streak, etc.

Once you die from any PvP encounter, regardless of team, you get put on a third team, Contemplation. In this state you cannot engage or be engaged in any kind of PvP. This way someone who is in a PvE mood can avoid being griefed, but buffs and heals would have to be set up as same team only.
After a period of time, maybe a few hours, you revert to Harmony automatically. Alternatively, you could complete a relatively simple quest to get there quicker. That way you could get back to the action with enough delay to prevent bind rushing.

I had most of it coded but I gave up after seeing how common cheats were in use just in PvE. I didn't think I could keep up with all of the necessary babysitting.

[sunbeam]

You know, maybe this is peeing on your thread or something, I don't know.

But with the population of most of these emu servers how can you possibly have a pvp server?

Seems to me it is uncommon to have more than 5 or 10 people on at a time for most. A few seem to get into the 20 to 40 range.

A very few have more, then you have the bot army servers and P1999.

PVP has always been less popular than PVE.

So how many guys can you expect to play on a PVP server?

10 people on the server... just doesn't seem very interesting. More like Spy vs. Spy.

[Lane]

Usually the PvP servers bring in a population of anywhere from 50-100 players, at least, at launch. EQ PvP has a small community, but it is very popular with a few hundred of us, who are constantly lurking forums for something new.

When Project1999 PvP was release, we saw over 600 players try out the server. Unfortauntely, it died out quite severely and now is in the 100 player range (which is still good), but players want something new due to the #1 guild on P99 PvP just dominating everything based on gear and numbers.

[Lane]

Originally Posted by Tabasco

When I first started tinkering with emu I was going to try a pvp server that could possibly refresh the attitude that you used to be able to find on Tallon Zek. Early on a lot of people had a role-played attitude about it and the server was basically PvE with real accountability.

The idea might not fit what you're wanting to do, but I'll share it because I would love to see it realized, especially by people with experience handling the issues that come with PvP servers.

Basically everyone starts out on the same team, Harmony, or whatever you want to call it.
Once you get a certain amount of people the server picks one at random and presents a popup trying to entice them to Discord. (That's where Discordant Whisper came from, which ended up being pure PvE)
You would probably need to tweak the ratio, but the idea is to maintain a pool of outlaws. I was thinking 1 in 10, but it really depends on your total population.

You could be grouped up with someone and they could suddenly be able to attack you, assuming they decide to go rogue. I figured I would announce the killer and the killed so that people are compelled to start tracking them.
The idea is to get as many kills as you can before you are taken down, or even group up with other discordants if possible. You could set up leaderboards based on longest time alive, longest streak, etc.

Once you die from any PvP encounter, regardless of team, you get put on a third team, Contemplation. In this state you cannot engage or be engaged in any kind of PvP. This way someone who is in a PvE mood can avoid being griefed, but buffs and heals would have to be set up as same team only.
After a period of time, maybe a few hours, you revert to Harmony automatically. Alternatively, you could complete a relatively simple quest to get there quicker. That way you could get back to the action with enough delay to prevent bind rushing.

I had most of it coded but I gave up after seeing how common cheats were in use just in PvE. I didn't think I could keep up with all of the necessary babysitting.

This is a very cool idea but I think the idea of harmony for us is a little too passive. I really do like the "murderer" flag idea though

[Aonelyn]

Guildwars.

[knowom]

Sound interesting Tabasco I like the idea of sort of player driven load balancing for team pvp. I kind of wanted to do that for DotaQuest a bit through questing and even standard farming. Your idea is nice as well though and would likely compliment a bit of what I all ready had in mind for player driven load balancing for pvp/pve within the game.

As far as what Lane is asking with this topic I think it depends on the server and it's goals. If I had to pick which I'd prefer to see it would probably be team pvp and no loot, but it depends on how the server is setup and managed in part as well. I don't find EQ to really be the type of game that was designed well in mind for item loot due to the fact that the loot itself can either be too powerful in relative terms or too hard to acquire. The end result is your going to get organized gank flash mobs that sporadically run around grieving everyone and no can really deter against worth a damn.

UO had full loot, but it was designed just casual friendly enough in mind that even newbies could band together and feel like they were making a difference. I don't see that really being quite the same situation in EQ it's a top heavy game economy where the 1% kind of dictates and rules the 99%. That's just my viewpoint on the subject, but everyone is kind of entitled to their own. If I did provide item loot I'd intentionally make loot itself more easy to obtain in general to offset rampant loot whoring player grieving. With it being team it might not be as big a concern though and with enough teams.

[knowom]

Originally Posted by Lane

Usually the PvP servers bring in a population of anywhere from 50-100 players, at least, at launch. EQ PvP has a small community, but it is very popular with a few hundred of us, who are constantly lurking forums for something new.

When Project1999 PvP was release, we saw over 600 players try out the server. Unfortauntely, it died out quite severely and now is in the 100 player range (which is still good), but players want something new due to the #1 guild on P99 PvP just dominating everything based on gear and numbers.

See that's exactly the sort of thing I want to avoid for DotaQuest I want a flexible server that isn't designed around hefty requirements in order to compete and sporadic enough that no one can easily just dominate and be king of the hill indefinitely.

I really want a different kind of PVE/PVP hybrid experience where it's not simply a case of a player coming along and zerging you or ganking you at low health. I'd like to design a little of that randomness into the PVE as well so it's hard to know what to expect. A group might be planning a gank then get blindsided as a result of a quest turn in another zone.

A lot of PVP/PVE gaming is a bit stale in my eyes and in need of innovation from developers daring enough to step outside the box a bit and try out brash and different new idea's. Some games are bit too linear or predictable and boring due to it.

[atrayas]

I always liked how eq2 pvp worked with the goods (qeynos) the bads (freeport)...then they introduced neutrals, this is were it got interesting, if you chose to become neutral you were kos to both sides, so it was just pure mahem from then on. Was a quest of some sorts to become neutral and they had there own little camp to go to.

I also loved the TZ style from back in the day. I hated pandemonium so much but tbh my most hated nemesis was in a guild called Liberation of the underfoot...lil guy had a faster pc than me at the time so he would just zone camp me or corpse camp me. But the 4 teams (humans, darks, shorts, elves) was pretty awsome.

[Tabasco]

Originally Posted by atrayas

my most hated nemesis was in a guild called Liberation of the underfoot

I was one of the first members of LotU. I used to hunt with a rogue that went by Pheelmi. We always used to joke that someday we would be reminiscing in public and get attacked by someone we killed.

[djlegit83]

loved TZ, was in human team guilds and a couple of 'darky' guilds.

The problem with PvP on EMU is there are so many freakin cheaters which takes the fun out of it. There were probably cheaters back in the day, but I bet there were far fewer percentage wise.

[rhyotte]

Lane,

I had a concept I started to work on for a server I was tinkering with....

--- Dragons Vs. Giants -+- Take the original premise, tweak it, and extend it.

--- Antonica:: Mod the barbarian starting areas to more properly correspond to Giants. Possibly mod *elves* DE and HE respectively for an association with dragons? Etc..
1) Extended antonica with the Drakkin and associated zones. Mainly for the Giants, but mod in some Dragons properly.

--- Kunark:: Take everone's fave Leezards and tweak in a ... neutrality tie-in / conflict for the Dragon Vs. Giants premise that was Vellious...

--- Vellious:: Ahhh good old Vellious! Loved that expansion... Dragons Vs. Giants anyone? In my opinion they never really finished out the D vs. G story. Take most of the quests for gear and armor etc that is in place and obviously mod things upward, and outwards a good bit.

---+--- Ok so, the premise that ties in PvP and PvE is that players start out sworn to Dragon or Giant Faction / side via their choice of deity. Lizards, Cats, Half Elves, Halflings, and probably Humans can swear to a neutral path that straddles the story line in a nicely blurry / grey way.
-- Here is the PVP tie in... A Dragon sworn player kills a Giants sworn player... said player gets approximately 10x the faction hit that killing a PvE mob would generate, plus the player gets to loot the fallen Giant Sworn's body of a varied amount of slots. This variance would be level dependant. Low level players: you get 1 item from them, and it is a non critical slot. Medium level players: you get 2 items and 1 can possibly be a main type slot. High level players: you get 3 items from pretty much any non Bags-Inventory slot. The amount of faction and experience you get from a player uses the standard CON system already in place, but obviously modified for a PvP _+_

This faction can be not only Dragon / Giant related, but Deity as well. The spell system would be worked over to have a GREY area of base spells, and then the really interesting spells are Dragon / Giant / Deity related. Well, spells and/or gear etc... Btw.. Player (A) kills Player (B), gets a Main Slot Loot: Brestplate baby! This is Dragon Vs. Giant btw, Player (B) was Giant faction, and his breastplate was his spankin' new Quest one! Congrats to player (A), you just got an item you can turn in for your own Dragon Quest Breastplate! ... PvP BABY! YEAH!

Just a few old ideas that were rattling around in my musty, dusty brain.
Gary

[knowom]

I honestly feel MMO's are better when they cater to more than two sides. Utilizing Dragons vs Giants as form of peace treaty alliance with opposing deities or factions belong to them would be nice though. Something like having each faction at war with one another then using Dragon vs Giants a a deity that can make you neutral to opposing faction members of the same deity.

[rhyotte]

Adding in Deity dimensions to the mix would certainly make matters interesting, which is why I mentioned them as both a faction thing and a Spells Thing.