Differences between cavedude DB and PEQ DB?

[Arex]

Hi guys, i would like to know what are the main differences between cavedude DB and PEQ velious RC-1 DB, i have read that cavedude DB have done until Luclin, but it is not too much accurate with his spawns. how bad accurate is it? i dont matter if i am lossing any spawns using cavedude, always that all important mobs are in.

anybody can help me to get a aproximate idea on what DB i should use? thx.

[tallerin]

Peq is pretty much accurate up to velious. Cavedudes DB is good i have used it but there is missing spawns that i have noticed and his goes upto some pop zones. If you know how or wanting to add spawns to a DB i would say cavedudes would be a very good start point.

[Arex]

[quote]Cavedudes DB is good i have used it but there is missing spawns that i have noticed and his goes upto some pop zones.[\quote]

When u say that Cavedude DB is missing spawns, u mean missing like 10-20 mobs per zone, or missing a lot of mobs? and all mobs include on cavedude DB have correct HP, effects, etc?

Thx for u reply tallerin =)

[SiliconeClone]

CaveDude's DB is not very different from PEQ's as far as Classic-Velious is concerned (it varies very little). As far as missing spawns, it is the later expansions that the DB is missing spawns in. But to be honest since PEQ does not have the later expansions spawned at all I tend to deal with the missing spawns in CaveDude's DB.

Overall CaveDudes' is a very nice starting point for future expansions. But if you want to keep the server as accurate as possible then use PEQ's and help them with find bugs and stuff to smooth out the DB they are making, since they are going fro 100% accuracy or as close as they can :)

[Arex]

ok, thx SiliconeClone, i think that i ll use cavedude DB, because PEQ is taking a lot of time for release each new expansion, i think that they should release alpha or beta versions of next expansion sooner, then community can help to fix bugs fastly.

[fathernitwit]

its a nice idea Arex, but the fact is... nobody ever helps. I havent seen a single line of SQL posted reguarding fixing the PEQ database since I have been here (by non-PEQ quest team), with the exception of global, non-PEQ specific things like zone lines/doors. I would love for this to change, but I dont think its going to.

[SiliconeClone]

Aye what FNW said, they don't get alot of help over there. That makes things very, very slow. There are packet collectors and such you can use to help. Or simply using their database and running around and finding things.. even simple things, like such and such has the wrong faction. The more help they have (even if it is just feedback) the faster they will move along.

I'd love to say that I help over there but honestly I don't. Then again I don't even really run a server or play eqlive, I just like to fiddle with things lol.

But the rest of it is what it is. Want expansions faster, then help them get it out. :)

[Arex]

I am sure that community could help to PEQ, if they release 1 snapshot of his DB each month, then ppl can to see that the bugs that they have posted on PEQ forums have been fixed and they continue working on improve PEQ-DB, but PEQ makes 1 release each 4-6 months, it give a feeling of project is neglect. I know that u are doing very nice DB's, but i think that u policy of releases is wrong.

For example, u could give a release each month with ONLY 4-5 zones more done, then ppl begin to check that zones and could post bugs, fix, etc. I am sure that u could revive project doing it.

[cavedude]

PEQ's database is better overall. They are both accurate in that fact that the base spawns were created from Live logs. However, PEQ spent a lot more time perfecting the spawns, factions, and loot where as I just populated all the zones I could and corrected any blarring errors that I found along the way. I actually never intending on releasing my database. My original intend was that I'd create a database from scratch as a learning tool. I never really thought people would like it as much as they do. So, coming from the horse's mouth:

If you want a more Live-like gaming experience, go with PEQ.

If you want to play on Luclin and some PoP zones, go with mine.

As for the time between releases... you're going to find that most of the sub-projects within EQEmu suffer from that. The simple fact is there aren't many of us working on things and the few there are are all just doing what we can to help. Plus, I am pretty certain that most of the devels/world builders are older so we have wives, kids, jobs, and the like to worry about. Just be patient and I assure you the wait is always well worth it in this community.

[nadineemu]

just a question, is there a way to combine cavedudes and PEQ database'es into one, but so that cavedudes doesn't overwrite the already present mob info on PEQ database, or will it just add a ton of duplicates?

[cavedude]

Sure they can be combined, but I'm not going to. It would take too much time I don't have.

[fireclav]

are the models of the mobs in there or how does one go about taking that from live and planting it into the game, never done any work with this at all and looking to populate the database more

[sdabbs65]

are the models of the mobs in there or how does one go about taking that from live and planting it into the game, never done any work with this at all and looking to populate the database more
You can always hand spawn the Mobs but that would take years.
FNW said the current packet collecter don't work with live.
also note that eqbuilder and eqextractor does not work with live.

[Angelox]

its a nice idea Arex, but the fact is... nobody ever helps. I havent seen a single line of SQL posted reguarding fixing the PEQ database since I have been here (by non-PEQ quest team), with the exception of global, non-PEQ specific things like zone lines/doors. I would love for this to change, but I dont think its going to.

You know, I'd love to help out - I tried playing on your PEQ server, but when I realized drops and loot tables, were missing, and spells become less and less available as you go up in levels, I stopped and went over to my server where I can look at the loot tables and spawns and what ever else, fix them myself. I've always been a "drop fanatic" - I played EQ live for many years (since they started), and all I ever did was camp mobs for their drops. I have many drop rates and spawns from a lot of zones "engraved" in my head.
But how do I tell you what needs to be fixed on spawns and drops? what if you already fixed it in your current datqbase, and I'm wasting your time? I only know whats wrong from the PEQ database availale to the users.
I noticed my favorite expansion LoY, has all zones unpopulated - I have downloaded editors and have them all working, but there must be some table missing for the LoY zones, that enables a starting point for all the NPCs to be placed. I can't (for the life of me) get one NPC to stick there. If someone told me how, I could have most of those zones poplulated with all the named NPC's and their drops. You could then have my work and use it with what you have.
Harbringer's Spire is a great zone - It's all in my head too; I can still see them all standing in their spawn spots. But when it comes to PEQ, I'm still green as they come, trying to figure things out on how to get a bare zone like that rolling.

[curt1zzle]

its a nice idea Arex, but the fact is... nobody ever helps. I havent seen a single line of SQL posted reguarding fixing the PEQ database since I have been here (by non-PEQ quest team), with the exception of global, non-PEQ specific things like zone lines/doors. I would love for this to change, but I dont think its going to.

It's not a simple task. I'm sure if the ordinary user was capable that you'd get a lot more help.

I for one would help if I knew how...

[Belfedia]

I for one would help if I knew how...

That the problem for all people, this is a hard work to combine this 2 db.
Making a program for make that, take a long time :(

[GeorgeS]

Yes it's hard work, but more so, very prone to errors.

I have thought of combining the two, but it's complicated, and requires lot's of 'hand crafted code'

Simple things like tradeskill recipes should be easier to merge, but the itemid's may be different

even the database schemas are different in some aspects. There are reference tables (like classes, races, spells) in Cavedudes DB that are excellent, and should be inlcuded in PEQ.

I'm looking into some of these tasks...
GeorgeS

[EliteSting]

I'm currently starting work on Luclin, I spent many years playing live and have first hand knowledge of every luclin zone. After I get some zones done I'll post the database ( using cavedudes db , I like the idea of combining the two though , maybe I'll look into that ). It's going to be a while though , even with the db , item , and quest editors I have up and going. I'm a perfectionist , and don't like leaving anything half-assed , so yeah it may be a while. My current dilema is figuring out how to run scripts in game , so I can write encounters and tune them properly ( or as close as I can get them ).... O.o nm , I just had an idea. ><

[sesmar]

even the database schemas are different in some aspects. There are reference tables (like classes, races, spells) in Cavedudes DB that are excellent, and should be inlcuded in PEQ.

The reference tables, and dont quote me on this, I believe came from my DB editor, and from the Allakazam Clone (races and spells). I was using these tables for my DB Classes that I wrote in order to make it easier for the user to enter Bodytype, class, race and spell information. As far as the base information goes, as long as you keep up on the SQL updates from the Changelog in both Cavedudes and the PEQ DB they should have the exact same schema or the Emulator would not work with them.

[Angelox]

How about something in the line of a "public" database? since PEQ editor is web-based and you can actually set it up at any web site, point it to the PEQ or EQ database you want to work on, give it a unique password, and you're ready to start.
You could have a group of people adding data to it like this. I think Cavedude's would be the one to use, since it gives a better start for something like this.
Problems would be - how would you decide how to choose/trust for adding data here? you can't let everyone, that would result in problems. And the database would have to be tested/backed up often, since it can pick up bugs while editing.

[CamelFilter]

Only problem I can see with that, is too many peeps adding diff loot tables and whatnot, losing track. If someone did that I'd suggest having certain people work on certain tables. Like one person on NPCs, their pathing, and spawngroups. One on aggro and loot tables. One on errmm AAs... Something like that. But they'd all have to work around the same rea at the same time. Just doing like one zone at a time.

[fathernitwit]

A couple comments, and I understand that not everybody will agree with these statements, but here goes.

If you are going to tune a database by hand, working on an expansions which PEQ has released (aka luclin), its really better for everybody if you make changes to the PEQ database.... The two databases exist due to different goals in short: PEQ is quality and cavedude is quantity. PEQ has done much more work to improve the quality of the zones it has built (hence why it takes so long), and fine-tuning another DB would likely be replicating much of this work. Further, the PEQ quest pack covers several encounters from luclin (thanks to Ylosh), and will only work with PEQ's DB.

Furthur, if you DO work on a database, reguardless of which one it is, you really should post the SQL updates you run, not your entire database... otherwise your going to essentially start a new fork because theres no reasonable way that I know of to find the changes made. PEQ editor will log all of its changes for you, and I even wrote some in-game SQL logging a while back (which I just had to fix today), but other SQL changes would need to be logged by hand.

[mattmeck]

The two databases exist due to different goals in short: PEQ is quality and cavedude is quantity.

To stop the flames


Cavedude admits this, he went for more spawns, that may or may not be live like.

PeQ is going for 100% live like.

Some people want live, some people dont care and just wants the zones spawned with anything, and others want a whole custom world.

This is why there is several forks.

[Angelox]

The reason why I chose EQ over PEQ is because I know there is a lot of work to be done reguardless - since this is all new to me and I am not what you call a "programmer", EQ gave me a jump start on a lot of zones. For example PEQ LoY is void of NPCs, but EQ on the other hand has NPCs - this to me at the time meant i didn't need to figure out how to get the first few models in the zones. Now, I saw where I can easily do that. I even asked for some help on how to do this, but got no answers. I know you guys must be very busy with your work, so I've "blundered" around tell I got a "working" system with a couple of the editors that are out there. I know what I wanted to know was buried somewhere in a Waki, but at the time, I couldn't find it. This is why i try to help all the new users as much as possible with whatever I learned so far. I figure if nothing else, we at least have another "customer" for the EQEMU Servers. I know they are like me: blinded by all the "newness" of everything, and need a little push start. If not, they could get frustrated and quit.
I can easily go back to PEQ, and I will -What I'll loose mostly is my "Harbingers' Spire" work, but I can always open up two PEQ Editors, one EQ and one PEQ and copy it over.
Tell me where I can post these updates to the SQL database so it will help you - I saw where I had the PEQ editor logging disabled, but I will enable it, and restart with PEQ.