76,845 registered users - Page 2

**GeorgeS** · #16 07-16-2007, 10:15 PM

Although it's not as busy as it's been back in '02!, the people that are still here are hard core fans of EQ.

What keep me playing after all this time, like any game I enjoy is to relive the 'live' experiences from way back then on my server, and really enjoy that.

I think there has to be a re-org of the code and establishment so we can plan what needs to be done. It feels like we are running a business without a plan and CEO. I'm willing to help code the emu, but C++ is not my strength. Unfortunately there's no written details on how to make diffs or figure out structs in the source.

I will however remain as the toolman here - as that is my niche, and good tools are like good food - make you feel good inside!

GeorgeS

John Adams · #17 07-17-2007, 09:41 AM

GeorgeS, you are on the money. Not so much a complete re-write, or re-structuring, but something needs to be done to allow more people to easily play this emulator, or it may not survive. I do agree the old school, "love EQ for EQ" players are still here and always will be. But in order to draw new attention to those who's first game may not have been EQ, but something else and they want to test-drive what it was like to REALLY have to play a game properly... hunting down nearly extinct copies of Titanium, and the cumbersome setup of the emu leaves a bad taste. Wow that was a run-on statement.

Anyway. For the last year, I have been absorbing EQEmu code, as well as comparing it to many other MMO emulators that seem to be a little more 'modern'. My hopes are that I will suddenly learn something that makes sense and I too can start making C++ changes where needed. I'm totally into it, just lack some of the basic knowledge.

Don't get me wrong, anyone Dev'ing EQEmu. This thing kicks ass, and I for one am very greatful to have discovered it. But, I seriously believe we need more dev attention (from more devs, not the current overworked ones

) and to make things simpler (I am working on one solution now, almost done!)

-J

ZexisStryfe · #18 07-17-2007, 11:39 AM

I must say, I guess I am not like the usual EQEmu user. I never really wanted to relive the "glory days" of EQ. I wanted to play something new, and more importantly, using the zones, models, etc. present in EQ, I wanted to create something new. I wanted to be able to create my own world. The fact that EQEmu doesn't patch to live is a big problem. Because of this, I must agree with Amra regarding open-sourcing. I know Wind spoke of cheating if they were to do this, but if the login server code was released, and people were able to set up their own logins separate from EQemu.net's server list, then I don't view it as so much of a problem (for instance, make sure the servers on EQEmu Login are "official", and if you want to hack and change your client, then use the released login server. The minilogin helps, but you are limiting the community by forcing them to use your login server).

A perfect example of this already exists. The most popular EQEmu server out there is a world where they took the client/server and changed it and were able to create their own world. Now I understand that they do things that are considered "illegal" here, and because of that just naming them is enough to get a thread closed, but come on. At any given time they have more players on their server than all of the "official" servers on EQEmu.net combined. Obviously they are doing something right, whether or not anyone here is willing to admit it.

It is my hope that EQ2Emu will end up having a released Login server, and that it gets more backing from developers than EQEmu currently has. If this turns out to be the case, then hopefully I will be able to create my vision there, since I am just not capable of doing it with the current EQEmu.

John Adams · #19 07-17-2007, 01:32 PM

The reason the login server code will never be released is due to the encryption stuff in there that would impose on Live servers - which would bring the thought police down on EQEmu and it would be very bad.

However, a dev responsible for updating it, changing it, making it more flexible and available itself, would be nice. Too bad for all those disassemblers.

devn00b · #20 07-17-2007, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Adams

The reason the login server code will never be released is due to the encryption stuff in there that would impose on Live servers - which would bring the thought police down on EQEmu and it would be very bad.

However, a dev responsible for updating it, changing it, making it more flexible and available itself, would be nice. Too bad for all those disassemblers.

Originally it was kept secret not for fear of "police", but because if we had released it sony would change it, and thats a major pain in the ass to fix.

Windcatcher · #21 07-17-2007, 04:28 PM

One thing I'd like to point out is that SimpleClient uses entirely its own LS protocol. Doodman's LS supports it, but SimpleClient connects to it using a separate port and it goes through a totally different code path. One possibility for open-sourcing the client might be to implement our own encryption on the SimpleClient LS protocol and use a closed-source code module for it. Then we might be able to release every part of the client except that part, which would let people compile their own clients for use with their own servers. We would have to also release an open-source version of a LS that only SimpleClient could talk to (minus encryption), but that shouldn't be a problem (I've already written a simple one that's sort of like Minilogin). I'd really like to hear the devs' take on this idea.

techguy84 · #22 07-17-2007, 07:58 PM

Does SOE still use the same encryption on LIVE knowing that EQEmu uses it also. I find that really hard to belive, as you would think that they would change that to something similar to EQ2 and update all the clients.

Xavius · #23 08-05-2007, 08:14 AM

I know I'm fairly new to the EQEmu scene, but just got myself together and got my server up and running, my goal is to build a custom server with custom content, expanding as the server grows...

Anyway, back to my reason for posting, have to agree that if EQEmu remains tied to a CD copy of EQ (Titanium), and access to that CD becomes restricted - its not sold over the counter anywhere I know of anymore. Then logically you're new player base will dry up, especially if they know they can go out and quite easily obtain other game emulators. To me this would sort of explain largely a dwindling player base - can folks still get hold of the Titanium Client - if not, doesnt it make sense to move to a newer client version (and I know this isnt as easy or straightforward as it might sound)?

Xavius

John Adams · #24 08-05-2007, 08:18 AM

The devs are playing with a newer Anniversary Edition as a base, but it might take some time to sort it all out. The source code shows the beginnings of it, but some have reported it's just not ready yet.

As for "dwindling populations", for me only being around a year I have to say the populations appear way UP right now from one year ago. I used to see servers with all 0's or 1-3 players online, except some of the preferred ones which were still not that impressive. Now, you can total nearly 200-300 players at any given time. To me, that seems like an increase.

This emu might never see it's SOE C&D days again, but I am happy it's around for when that dark day comes that EQLive is no longer worth SOE's budget. That's really all this is about to me.

**LethalEncounter** · #25 08-05-2007, 03:15 PM

Sorry if I'm a couple of weeks late, but I just noticed this thread. I believe that enforcing client upgrades is the simpliest of the problems you are facing. The way EQ2 does it, is that the client sends its version number to the login server before it logs in. If the version number is too old it cant login. You could do something similiar. Another thing you could do is just randomly change opcodes every patch to prevent old clients from working

Quote:

Originally Posted by Windcatcher

The problem is cheating. If it's open source there's nothing stopping cheaters from going crazy, and believe me, now that I've written one I can see all kinds of ways that cheaters could take advantage. So as much as I would like to make it open source, I doubt that it can happen for the really important parts (though many parts CAN be open-sourced, such as the netcode, content loader, 3D engine, collision avoidance, etc.). By the way, SimpleClient uses the same engine as OpenZone, so if you downloaded OZ then you already have all the 3D engine and collision avoidance code...

One question that I need answered, and only the devs can do this for me, is how to enforce client upgrades. As we fix bugs, close exploits, etc. there needs to be a way that ensures that people upgrade. It's ironic that with our own client we find ourselves in the same position as SOE, but there you have it. So anyhow I need an answer to that before I/we release it.

Edit: Someone will definitely get the full source, if nothing else to ensure the longevity of the client. I have no idea who that will be, as I haven't thought about it, but that will have to be another dev discussion. Whoever gets it will definitely need to have Delphi 6 or 7 (the personal version would be just fine). It can also be ported to newer versions -- I once ported it to Delphi 2006 but I hated D2006 so much that I dropped it and went back to D6.

Wizzel · #26 08-05-2007, 08:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Adams

The devs are playing with a newer Anniversary Edition as a base, but it might take some time to sort it all out. The source code shows the beginnings of it, but some have reported it's just not ready yet.

As for "dwindling populations", for me only being around a year I have to say the populations appear way UP right now from one year ago. I used to see servers with all 0's or 1-3 players online, except some of the preferred ones which were still not that impressive. Now, you can total nearly 200-300 players at any given time. To me, that seems like an increase.

This emu might never see it's SOE C&D days again, but I am happy it's around for when that dark day comes that EQLive is no longer worth SOE's budget. That's really all this is about to me.

Why will the end of Everquest Live be the dark days. Sure, a lot of people are still invested in the game, but at the current rate, Everquest is digging itself a grave. People don't leave a game because they are overjoyed. People leave because they are tired of the same. The end of Everquest Live will only mean a population increase here and more people willing to lend a hand. Do you still play EQLive?

-Wizzel

John Adams · #27 08-07-2007, 03:11 AM

Wizzel, if you are going to follow me around the forums and openly disagree with everything I say, I am going to develop a chronic dickhead complex.

If you are honestly asking why I think EQ's closure will be "a dark day", it is merely for the nostalgia of the game from a day when it WAS playable and enjoyable by so many for so long. Dark Day = End of an Era, which I guess to most has already happened.

As for my play time, I definitely do not "play" like I used to... but I am a guild leader still, and login regularly if for nothing more than to make my presence known and chat with the very few remaining friends I have that still log in.

Quote:

Everquest is digging itself a grave.

Agreed. :(