Guild Wars Locked

[DeletedUser]

Guild Wars will be staying locked for a undetermined amount of time, it will be whatever it takes to make a legit server possible. In the last couple of weeks exploiting has been all over the Guild Wars server and it is obvious there is no fair play going on. I will be spending my time fixing these bugs and also working on getting EQEMu to work with EQLive with the other developers. During this time of the server being locked, we will be working on the content of the server (Quests, Events, etc.). I apologize for this, but there is no reason to host a legit server for people to exploit it.

[Nira]

I was only level 5, but this IS good for the server

[Zante]

It's difficult for many people to support the decision as currently they're so involved with the community on GW they want to continue playing :x It is for the best though and anything that can improve our gaming experience should be recognised as being the main concern.
The emulation has come such a long way and it's a huge achievement to get this far. Many thanks for the work that you continue to put into Guild Wars Image, Devn00b & Lethal as well as all the other people not directly associated with GW.

[Deathspawn]

I agree with the decision to lock down the server until appropriate changes can be made to better suit the needs of everyone. You may think now that this is not fun, cool, etc... But, you need to understand that this is for the good of the server as a whole. Image, Devn00b, Lethal, and those out there who put their work into the server have done a great job and all I see from them is great work. The suggestions and bug reports from the players help out a great deal as well to help this ever evolving community of online players. I would think us all so lucky to walk among this server that is being guided by such good people. In my short time on this server I have seen more commitment from people then my entire years at EQLive. I think that this server does need a forum of it's own and purhaps some other off-game/online things. Bug Email Address, Game Forum, Suggestions/Comments Forum, etc. etc. The better our communication the faster and more efficent we can get the server up and totally legit.

Great work Dev Staff of GW. And, thanks for the patience of the GW community in the wait to see the server rise above all others.

Your Friend,

HITMAN SHADOWSTALKER
:| --==Mobster of Bristlebane==--
:| --==Rogue of Kelethin==--
:twisted: --==Lover of Highelven Women==--

[Edge Suikendi]

People just need to stop abusing bugs they find. Report it, keep what you got on the first occurance, then leave it alone until it's fixed. It's all about the players decisions that make a board completely legit.

[lord_aiden]

I just want to say thank you...to all of you people who took away the best thing EQEmu has to offer us. Your stupid, pointless, and idiotic exploiting has robbed the legitimite players of the privlege of playing on a server that was worked hard on...only to be made non-available to the stupid f*ckers who deciced that they couldn't just play legitimtly...NO they had to be the biggest and the best...no matter what the cost and no matter how they do it...did they once think about the consequences that would entail. No...now because of their stupid actions, I and many of the legitimite players are stuck with the same old non legitimite servers with #summonitem this and #summonitem that.

And the hard work that went on to this project...all to no avail, the whole concept just shi*ted on by these fucking exploiters. You guys make me sick man...you are just not cool...if I was an administrator in this project...you would be banned...if I find out any of you f*ckers who were exploiting on this server, you will be banned on any server that I administrate.

Fair warning.

Good day.

*edited profanity*

[Julio]

i just wanted to say the the guild wars server is the best server on eqemu and i really wish it wasnt locked, but i understand that u guys gotta do what ya gotta do.

lvl 20 cleric
calan marr
lethal encounters

[r4kin]

aw man;/

yes, I agree w/ lord_aiden in a way that it really pisses me off too how exploiters ruined GW for the rest of us, but in the end, it's for the better.

once I found GW, I never went around to look for another server. recently, in the past few days I've been wandering around connecting to random servers, but.. I think that I had such a *good* experience w/ GW, that I've grown picky of what I would look for in a good server.

dammit, I can *see* the guildwars server in the log-in screen whenever I log on to see if it's up, but the 'LOCKED' tag next to it is just a tease. gah, ohwell. it'll give me time to catch up on that... sleep... thing. :P

[Leefless]

[Slayer02]

This is indeed grave news. I did not play much (I got caught behind and every was 30 - 50 and I was 5) so I didn't play much but when I did it was a great experience. I haven't played recently to see what was going on but if there is alot of exploiting it needs to be stopped. I completely support you in your decision image, it is the right thing to do. P.S. to all you exploiters: Sie dumme Mutterbumser nahmen die beste Sache, die wir weg von uns hatten und ich verfluche Ihr fucking Grab. Sie sind lame Mutterbumser, Brand in der H

Sucks that the exploiters ruined it for you all, sorry to all those who I banned/kicked/threatened and all that.. won't happen again :(

[Nima]

I just want to say thank you...to all of you people who took away the best thing EQEmu has to offer us. Your stupid, pointless, and idiotic exploiting has robbed the legitimite players of the privlege of playing on a server that was worked hard on...only to be made non-available to the stupid f*ckers who deciced that they couldn't just play legitimtly...NO they had to be the biggest and the best...no matter what the cost and no matter how they do it...did they once think about the consequences that would entail. No...now because of their stupid actions, I and many of the legitimite players are stuck with the same old non legitimite servers with #summonitem this and #summonitem that.

And the hard work that went on to this project...all to no avail, the whole concept just shi*ted on by these *** exploiters. You guys make me sick man...you are just not cool...if I was an administrator in this project...you would be banned...if I find out any of you f*ckers who were exploiting on this server, you will be banned on any server that I administrate.

Fair warning.

Good day.

*edited profanity*

really thats nice but i see the setting yourself to level 65 on other non legit servers as just as bad. People wanna get to the top easily without workin for it. It's sad.

[Slayer02]

I just want to say thank you...to all of you people who took away the best thing EQEmu has to offer us. Your stupid, pointless, and idiotic exploiting has robbed the legitimite players of the privlege of playing on a server that was worked hard on...only to be made non-available to the stupid f*ckers who deciced that they couldn't just play legitimtly...NO they had to be the biggest and the best...no matter what the cost and no matter how they do it...did they once think about the consequences that would entail. No...now because of their stupid actions, I and many of the legitimite players are stuck with the same old non legitimite servers with #summonitem this and #summonitem that.

And the hard work that went on to this project...all to no avail, the whole concept just shi*ted on by these *** exploiters. You guys make me sick man...you are just not cool...if I was an administrator in this project...you would be banned...if I find out any of you f*ckers who were exploiting on this server, you will be banned on any server that I administrate.

Fair warning.

Good day.

*edited profanity*

really thats nice but i see the setting yourself to level 65 on other non legit servers as just as bad. People wanna get to the top easily without workin for it. It's sad.
He maybe does do that on other servers but I know aiden well and he plays fair when he knows he should. Non legit servers are MADE so you can hack, and sometimes it is fun. It sucks though when you join a legit server and then try and cheat your way to the top.

[lord_aiden]

I didn't mean to imply that Image's decision was wrong...I agree with it and support him fully. I am just angered at the exploiters who ruined it for us all.

I wish there was something I could to to help.

[Trumpcard]

Starting coding and help us fix bugs ! ;-)

We love bugfixes!

[Edge Suikendi]

t. Like i said before its the stupid jerkoffs who ruin what we had going. I know TWO people who actually got to 50 legitimately, the rest I have no idea how the hell they did it. As for the rest, f*ck you. You need to quit being a bitch and play on the servers where everyone else is 50 too. And whoever said the #summon and exp up to 65 being cheating is absolutely right. I could see there being ONE test server to test out new spells, weapons, etc., but when all but one (Guild wars) is like that, theres a problem. As to image, do what you need to man, people wont stop being little punkasses until can't cheat. I wish we could play with the exp bonus, mana regen bonus, and SOME sort of money bonus (because all 3 of those are pains in the asses to get), but I fear that because people are just being (what havent I called them yet) little dipsh*ts, the server will lose the cool tweaks it had before to make the normal legitimate players not spend freakin 13 hours a day just to get their little guy to a big level.

<Bow> That is the end of my performance.

<Boooo... get off the stage>

[Edge Suikendi]

If ops know a way to find exploiters that are obviously doing it, delete them without warning. I'm tired of this AWESOME server going up and down up and down because of the players. LEGIT means legit, they had their warning in the server name.

PS - I don't know sh*t about what ops can or cannot do. :P

[Vermea]

Image, I'll address you first, seeing how you're the most important. Guildwars is the best and most fun server to play on. It's a shame that wherever there is a garauntee of legitamacy, there's always those who try so hard to get around it (perfect example is diablo 2's battle.net). It greatly upsets me to find out that the problem is worse than previously expect. You just take your time and fix what needs fixing and secure everything that needs to be secured.

As for all those who brought this on:
There are PLENTY of other servers to cheat on. You can have any item you want and be as powerful as you can possibly. With all this available to you, why must you bring it to the legit server(s)? I hope you all rot in hell.

This was my first Everquest experience, I never played EQ Live, so I don't know what it's like. But Guildwars was more than what I expected out of Everquest. I was hoping that it would remain that way but people have thrashed and struggled to find ways to cheat and ruined it for everyone on the server, both veterans and newbies alike.

Until all this is worked out, anyone can find me in #guildwars or #voxdei and sometimes #eqemu. Until the server is back up, I bid you all a farewell.

[Trumpcard]

I never logged onto GW myself. but it sounds like Image did an awesome job of proving that the code is now stable enough to support a LEGIT server type.

Good job image ! Sounds like it was a fun server.. Hopefully as we get bugs and exploits ironed out, it will show its face again.

[Vermea]

One more thing to the other admin:

I know image get's most of the credit for most things, but We can't leave the rest of the lackey's out :) Thanks to you guys who that try to make it a pleasent environment.

Kamikaze: No worries about the whole banning/death thing. I'm sure I did more than provoke you a little :) Let's just put it behind us, I'm sure everyone else will say the same.

[Nima]

He maybe does do that on other servers but I know aiden well and he plays fair when he knows he should. Non legit servers are MADE so you can hack, and sometimes it is fun. It sucks though when you join a legit server and then try and cheat your way to the top.

sorry, you got the wrong end of the stick hehe, i didnt mean aidan was settin himself to level 65 or anything i was talking as a generality. On most the servers there is some quick way to get to level 65. I wasn't bitching about it either, I just think it's stupid as hell cos for 1 it basically is cheating and 2 its ruining most of the fun and taking fun away from the game, I like to play properly :). Sorry that i caused confusion.

[Nima]

If ops know a way to find exploiters that are obviously doing it, delete them without warning. I'm tired of this AWESOME server going up and down up and down because of the players. LEGIT means legit, they had their warning in the server name.

PS - I don't know sh*t about what ops can or cannot do. :P

Well a great suggestion is to add maybe a way to snoop players or a way to log commands that players do so when they think something has gone wrong they can trawl through the logs on the server and find out who is abusing them.

Me and my boyfriend code MUD's and if we see someone abusing a bug without reporting; yeah they get deleted without hesitancy. I agree with deleting, but banning (i know you didn't mention it) could be really harsh.

[Edge Suikendi]

Banning is even better, I didn't think about it. IP banning is the best. I don't care how harsh it is, YOU SHOUDLNT HAVE BEEN CHEATING IN THE FIRST PLACE! The more that is to be lost means that more people will think twice about trying anything. Like I said before, if someone exploits and cheats, they are causing a whole servers worth of people headaches, so ban them. If they want to abuse free eq, they can get banned and go pay for it. Thats my view.

[Edgar1898]

Well a great suggestion is to add maybe a way to snoop players or a way to log commands that players do so when they think something has gone wrong they can trawl through the logs on the server and find out who is abusing them.


Hehe logging has been in for a little while. It will log whatever we want it to.

[Vermea]

Nira, I too play MUD's :) It's always good to find a kindred spirit in the vast empyness of the internet :) Snooping is a great way for the imms to see what others are doing...but on graphical games, I imagine it would be a little harder to do than on text-based games. It's a great idea, but I'm not sure how possible it would be...or practical for that matter. I'm not bashing you, by the way, I'm just saying I don't know if it's possible.

P.S. What MUD's do you code for/play, i'd love to play a mud of your's some time.

[Nima]

Nira, I too play MUD's :) It's always good to find a kindred spirit in the vast empyness of the internet :) Snooping is a great way for the imms to see what others are doing...but on graphical games, I imagine it would be a little harder to do than on text-based games. It's a great idea, but I'm not sure how possible it would be...or practical for that matter. I'm not bashing you, by the way, I'm just saying I don't know if it's possible.

P.S. What MUD's do you code for/play, i'd love to play a mud of your's some time.

heehe my name is nima :P. Anyway edge, on a place like everquest banning would be harsh, depending on what bug your abusing and if its tiny (like gaining some little tiny amount of money) and your char was a high level a simple deleting the char as punishment would work wonders, banning would just gain the persons rebellion in them and cause unwanted things to happen.. which can include with some of the hardcores DoS and annoyance e-mails, etc. It also gives admins a bad name when they use the ban button too frequently (and it also gives you a stigma as those people in question will say "oh you wont like so and so. They LOVE to abuse banning people). There is always going to be bugs, but without people finding those bugs how would you fix them? Banning won't really help things. If you bring yourself across as a no-nonsense person some people would possibly be scared to even report the bugs (fear of being banned). If your character just gets deleted at least you have the chance to still play and it can cause a great deal of embarassment to the person involved (it also works as a warning, next time: REPORT THE BUG OR BE BANNED). It makes you angry but from a logical point of view you don't run a mmorpg business that way (i know this is free but im pointing it out).
Anyway to answer your question Vermea. The shell we had got taken down and we aren't thinking of asking for it back. Me and my bf are thinking about going into the MMORPG business. We coded Savage Wars: Utopia and Cordia Legends. Mostly Pure PK and custom codes :).

[Edge Suikendi]

Abusing bugs. As I said in my original post if you find a bug you report it, keep what you found, and leave it along until its fixed. Cheating is cheating to me. Whether its money or exp or something else, if you are getting it in a way you aren't suppose to be getting it, it's cheating. In my opinion there needs to be a "No Bullsh*t" rule so people dont f*ck around. Little cheating can only lead to bigger cheating.

On a side note - I've been playing majormud for around 6 years now. By far the best out there. If you haven't played it goto www.mudcentral.com and pick a board from the free telnet sites. You can pick up megamud at www.megamud.net.

[IAAridaleBelmont]

1st off I love this server. Best emu server there is hands down. Image and Dev and the various others that contribute have done an amazing job thus far and I can not WAIT to log on once this lock is removed and we can start playin again wipe or no wipe.

I wish all you pathetic fucks that had to go be l337 and uber and find all the ways possible to cheat your way into what you could have just got simple man power to do. You know who you are and you know what you did. I hope you realize that the server is locked and none of us can play on our fav server right now all because of you.

Things could have continued the way they were and updates come as updates came and we all continue playing but no... a group of assholes had to sploit theyre ways to 'best players on the server' and cheat theyre way into all the dragon loot and so on and so forth and dont think the devs didnt know what was goin on cause they did.

If I were Image none of you I repeat NONE OF YOU would ever EVER log on to my server again as long as eq emu existed. Theres a good handful of ppl that play(ed) on GW and most of them were good ppl that wouldnt cheat even if they could. But theres always bad eggs. And they always ruin everyone else fun. I swear if I had the power you fucks would be banned from all legit servers so fast your fuckin heads would spin.

Image is a good guy and he works hard and spends lots of time on this server and I hate, for him and for the rest of us, to see it all shit away cause some lil fuckers think they own the place. Good thing for you Image is a much nicer guy than I am cause if I were him your asses would be toasted. He knows who you are or will know when he looks at the chars in the db and more than likely he will allow you to keep playing. If I were him Id allow ya to play just long enough to get a new char to 50 then Id delete it and tell everyone who you are and what you did.

Then Id ban you from the server then chat rooms and the forums and dare you to even try to get back on and let me find out about it. But like I said your lucky Im not Image.

I had a GREAT time on GW better by far than anything I ever had on live in all my 4 years of playin even with all the bugs and drops and the like it was still great. Id almost rather it be straight pvp than gvg but its all good.

If there is another wipe when the server comes unlocked I'll play again just cause I know this wipe was for the best and not the accident of a memory leak. This is a great server and I really really hope everything gets up to par from the devs point of view and we get to play again soon.

[IADaenks]

uhmm my server's Legit... come play there until GW is back up. :^)

-Daenks

[celes9]

::Wonders if Daenek realizes he put red con giant wasps in the felwithe noobie area::

Lesson 14, never assume that giant wasp cons even :)

[Vermea]

Well, I suppose it's time for everyone to just sit back and wait. Image, if you need any help with anything, I, for one, would be MUY HAPPY-O to help. ANYTHING ! :) But I do ask one favor, every now and then, how about a progress report? Just so everyone can stay filled in :) Thanks a ton.

You know, i sat here, and i pondered whether to just be an ass and flame you guys, or to try to develop some sort of arguement supporting non legit play.........what i've come to is the conclusion that it doesn't matter what i post, the reaction will still be the same.

i will say a few things though.

TRUE: players that exploit bugs should be dealt with....but who's fault is it really? Isn't the best way to stop someone from exploiting a bug........now get this........by FIXING OR REMOVING THE BUG?.....i've always felt the same way about exploiting bugs in EQLive......remove the temptation and there won't be a problem.

TRUE: cheat items are bad for the game, particularly connectivity and server integrity. but would it not be prudent to simply remove these items from the datatbase? what's that you say, there are too many to feasibly remove them all? how about start with the ones that cause known problems, like the LOH rings, the soul devourers, the insta click DD items and so forth. it's easy enough to go into your database and nix particular items, no? (i know this doesn't apply to all servers, since most legit servers don't implement #summonitem).

TRUE: if someone doesn't like legit play, they should feel free to go play on a non legit server. that is getting harder and harder to do. there is ONE stable legit server to date. and the mods there say it will soon be going legit. This blows my mind for many reasons; chief among them is the fact that it is the most popular non-green server based on 2 criteria 1). server stability 2). it is non legit. Sure, there are plenty of non-legit servers out there, but they are all flash in the pan servers (i.e. usually gone after a few days). Most will tell you (especially frequent forum posters) that this is because EVERYONE wants legit play.............this could be no further from the truth. all evidence suggests that the MAJORITY of EQEmu players are against legit play.

pro legit players will argue that the numbers indicate that most players use legit servers.............could this be that because in the recent months the only stable servers with any staying power have gone legit? could it be because players are being FORCED to play on legit servers? "now now Rag, no one is forcing you to do anything.........."okay then, i'll just go and play on another server.....oh look at that....the only servers that are currently up are all legit....

see what i mean?

when i've asked server ops and admins about removing the bugs and items that are being exploited, they always say, without fail "we're looking into that. you have to understand that the db is HUGE, and there are still many many bugs to be dealt with". while i can emphathize, i also have to point out that you've already gone to the trouble of creating your own server, customizing databases and countless other programs, and put in hundreds of hours towards development and so on, yet there are still THOUSANDS of bugs....

this is what i'm getting at....how can ANYONE even begin to fathom playing on a "legit" server with so many bugs in place?? i have tried so hard to understand this, but i simply can't. most "legit" servers aren't even populated with mobs to fight, let alone loot and quests (which i might add, is the real point of EQ, it says so in the name :P).

The answer to this question is always the same "EQEmu still has a long way to go".....that's right, it has a long way to go. a long way. and forcing your players to play legit on a buggy, empty, and unstable server is, for lack of a better word, and not to belittle those involved.....stupid. The point of any game is to have fun, no? and i fully understand that legit players are having fun on their legit servers. but there's something you should all understand.

not everyone wants legit play to be forced on them.

many of you have shown disdain for those few individuals who "ruined it for the rest of us" on GuildWars. I have news that may come as a shock to many of you..............the MAJORITY of players on GuildWars were using exploits. these exploits were cited many times a dayin /ooc, surely you must remember that. In fact, I will bet REAL MONEY that there is at least two of the above posters (slamming exploiters no less) who were KNOWN EXPLOITERS on Guildwars........hypocrasy at its best, no?

here's a QUOTE from an above post: There are PLENTY of other servers to cheat on. You can have any item you want and be as powerful as you can possibly. With all this available to you, why must you bring it to the legit server(s)? I hope you all rot in hell.

first of all, there aren't "plenty" of other servers to "cheat" on.....second of all, why is it cheating? as stated before, can it be called cheating when there's really no other way to get items (some servers' loot tables are better than others' admitedly). don't get me wrong, i absolutely HATE to see /ooc spammed by people saying "what's the best pally armor?" "best haste in game?" and so on......i have no love for people who can't do their own research.....and i also have no love for people who don exploit and GM items that they should NOT have access to.......but what, i ask, is wrong with gearing up with items that are available in EQLive, especially when you're dealing with an unstable server that may or may not even exist tomorrow?

the other thing i'll comment on from that post is the "I hope you all rot in hell" statement......you DO remember this is just a game, right? and you DO remember you're paying absolutely no money, right?.....right?......

the only other thing i want to comment on is something i've noticed only very recently.......Legit players don't like non-legit players........it reminds me so much of the disdain PVP players have for non-PVP players, that attitude that if you don't do it my way then you're nothing........Let me say this, i have NOTHING against legit play. IN THEORY it's a cool idea, but in practicallity, and this is MY OWN OPINION, it is stupid. i would love to see it work, but to date, no evidence has shown me that it can. while i've seen plenty of level 65s on legit servers, one must ask oneself how they did it......did they REALLY do it legitimately? did they actually level the way one would do so in EQ, with all the downtime and skill building involved? or did they simply throw on their can o' whoop ass and veeshan's peak no rent swords?

there's one fact that everyone seems to be overlooking, and it IS fact. non legit players have existed FAR LONGER here than legit players. to think that people were drawn here initially for "legit" play is ludicrous. every single one of us logged on to EQEmu for the exact same reason; to take advantage of the item database. not for the swell dynamic quest content, not for the social player base, but to simply twink out their dream toon. while i can understand that many of you would deny this, i don't need validation to know this is truth. it's common sense. it's common knowledge in fact.

so let me leave you guys who are all pissed off at exploiters and non legit players with a little advice. don't assume that the majority of eqemu players have any interest whatsoever in legit play. just because it's your bible to thump doesn't mean it's what we all want, or ever asked for. and it's clear that legit players are the most vocal of the fanbase, unfortunately. but DO try to have some consideration for non legit players....and don't assume that all non legit players simply want to be the most uber characters around and set out to take advantage of exploits.

and of course you're going to say "if you don't like it, then leave" i would have to say the same to you. i have played on EQEmu since darn near the beginning, and only in the last few weeks has it really begun to be not so fun. I attribute this to the sudden "suppression" of non legit play and players. folks, we were here long before you. and i dare say we will be here long after you decide that the whole EQEmu project was a failure. so please don't try to force your style of play on everyone else, or to belittle someone simply because they don't share your playstyle. most of us respect yours, try to respect ours.

ok i'm SURE whoever deleted my last post did so by mistake, and aren't trying to supress my data.......

[Artadius]

blah blah blah freakin blah...

I took the time to read your lovely post...so I hope you'll do the same for me.
Ok, I'll get to your points here:

You know, i sat here, and i pondered whether to just be an ass and flame you guys, or to try to develop some sort of arguement supporting non legit play.........what i've come to is the conclusion that it doesn't matter what i post, the reaction will still be the same.

I'll start off by saying that supporting non-legit play would be better served by hosting a server or supporting them directly in some way. Coming on and stirring up shit with the legit players doesn't support non-legit play in any way. So I'll take the rest of this drabble as flaming :roll:

TRUE: players that exploit bugs should be dealt with....but who's fault is it really? Isn't the best way to stop someone from exploiting a bug........now get this........by FIXING OR REMOVING THE BUG?.....i've always felt the same way about exploiting bugs in EQLive......remove the temptation and there won't be a problem.


Bugs in EQEmu are being fixed constantly, so I really don't see where your argument lies here. I can think of over 20 bugs that were fixed in GW within the first couple of weeks that it was up (either by their direct fix or EQemu general fixes). Unfortunately, people will always find a way to exploit..even in Live they do to this day. It's impossible to completely rid a game of some form of unintended bug.

TRUE: cheat items are bad for the game...

There's no issue with cheat items that I'm aware of in GW. It uses a database that mirrors EQLive before Kunark and many other changes were implemented. Some of us LIKE that time period of Live and can't get it anymore...even if we wanted to go to Live to enjoy pure legit play. I bet you never thought of this huh?

TRUE: if someone doesn't like legit play, they should feel free to go play on a non legit server. that is getting harder and harder to do. there is ONE stable legit server to date. and the mods there say it will soon be going legit. This blows my mind for many reasons; chief among them is the fact that it is the most popular non-green server based on 2 criteria 1). server stability 2). it is non legit. Sure, there are plenty of non-legit servers out there, but they are all flash in the pan servers (i.e. usually gone after a few days). Most will tell you (especially frequent forum posters) that this is because EVERYONE wants legit play.............this could be no further from the truth. all evidence suggests that the MAJORITY of EQEmu players are against legit play.

That is true. But why is it our fault? You're on some holier than thou crusade to piss on our enjoyment of the system. You don't see players wanting legit play getting on non-legit servers and moaning about the ability to #level and #summon and all...then come to the boards and rain on YOUR parade hmm? Look, if you want better non-legit servers..then host one yourself. I don't give a rats ass that you have a router problem. Work around it (get a non-router solution..new isp maybe??) or pay for a host to setup a server for you. OTHER people have taken that route before. If you're not willing to support the non-legit server aspect in any way wether by hosting yourrself or by providing financial support to those who share your view...then all you're good for is coming here and bitching and moaning. That makes you pretty worthless in most people's eyes..including mine. In fact the only reason I'm doing this is to hopefully give you a clue that some of us like legit for a reason and we don't have to explain ourselves to the like of you.

I don't KNOW which side has more players and you don't KNOW either..so until you can show some hard evidence...shut the hell up because it doesn't matter. I do KNOW though that the evidence favors more LEGIT players as the supply and demand would indicate that.

when i've asked server ops and admins about removing the bugs and items that are being exploited, they always say, without fail "we're looking into that. you have to understand that the db is HUGE, and there are still many many bugs to be dealt with". while i can emphathize, i also have to point out that you've already gone to the trouble of creating your own server, customizing databases and countless other programs, and put in hundreds of hours towards development and so on, yet there are still THOUSANDS of bugs....

Do you even help with the development of a server or the code at ALL?!? These people have lives you know..and it has been a huge task just to get to where we are now. Some of these folks have sacrificed thousands of man hours and dollars to bring this to us. They can't just fix things on a whim sometime. They have families, lives, jobs to attend to as well. Ungrateful ass! (remember, I deduced that your post was a flame, so I reserve the right to call you names :twisted: )

this is what i'm getting at....how can ANYONE even begin to fathom playing on a "legit" server with so many bugs in place?? i have tried so hard to understand this, but i simply can't. most "legit" servers aren't even populated with mobs to fight, let alone loot and quests

GW has plenty of mobs and loot tables. Where did you look? Get your head out of your ass and maybe you'd see. Also, there were quite a few people leveling up legitimately using no bugs or exploits..even to level 50. I'm not saying there aren't any bugs out there...but sometimes you just have to alter things a bit to enjoy them without the bugs. Yes there is usually a way to work around any bug currently.

I'll move on to the end now and ignore most of the rest of your idiocy..since it bears no meaning towards my issue here. Again, you have a holier than thou attitude:

there's one fact that everyone seems to be overlooking, and it IS fact. non legit players have existed FAR LONGER here than legit players. to think that people were drawn here initially for "legit" play is ludicrous. every single one of us logged on to EQEmu for the exact same reason; to take advantage of the item database. not for the swell dynamic quest content, not for the social player base, but to simply twink out their dream toon. while i can understand that many of you would deny this, i don't need validation to know this is truth. it's common sense. it's common knowledge in fact.

Again, how do you KNOW?? I've lurked here since THE beginning. When AGX was an newborn..I was watching. When hackersquest had a few hundred forum members total...I was lurking. And guess what...I wanted legit play. I wanted legit play with just a small portion of the population that you're forced to play with in Live. I don't enjoy the thousands of people competing over loot. IMHO a server is best with about a 50-75 playerbase. So, you're statement again, is false unimformed. You're making ASSumptions.

Honestly, noone really cares what you think...and I just wanted to stand up for what I believe in...not to come here and bring you down (although you must be smoking something..so come down please).

You claim that we're suppressing you in some way. I don't see any evidence of this. The only time legit players EVER harp on the #levelers is when THEY invade GW or another legit server and start bellyaching on why they can't be level 65 with plane armor immediately. Well, we get tired of hearing this twenty times a day..you would too.

So, in conclusion, I'll restate my main point. I play legit because thats what I like to do...its real simple. I enjoy GW because they are VERY close to EQLive before Kunark and most of the big changes. I can't get this ANYWHERE else...including Live. I was a dev for Winters Roar (which is unfortunately dead now). We had working quests, loot tables, and all zones were populated and ran well. It is possible to have a purely legit server...maybe not totally bug free..but Verant can't even lay claim to that either.

Look, I hate to sound like a broken record...but go fix your problem yourself. Learn the code, fix the bugs. Host a server or pay for a host yourself. Can't take it? Well, I'm sorry...but the legit players will never leave just like I'm sure some of the non-legit players will ever leave. Noone really ultimately cares so long as they have fun right? I'm having fun (well, when GW is back up). If you're not having fun...how is this my fault? Don't take your non-fun-having 5 year old attitude out on us...it's really quite pointless.

yes, i read the entire thing. twice. i got very little out of it, just a lot of immature name calling and accusations i've grown to expect from legit server advocates here.

QUOTE:I'll start off by saying that supporting non-legit play would be better served by hosting a server or supporting them directly in some way. Coming on and stirring up shit with the legit players doesn't support non-legit play in any way. So I'll take the rest of this drabble as flaming

as far as i know i'm not stirring up any "shit" as you call it. and by dismissing my post as flaming before you even read it, well why even try to argue with you? you clearly don't care what i think, nothing will make you understand my point of view, and nothing short of the project dieing will make you understand my concerns.

QUOTE: You don't see players wanting legit play getting on non-legit servers and moaning about the ability to #level and #summon and all

this is entirely false. that happens all the time. ALL the time. but you wouldn't know, since you clearly can't stand non legit servers.

QUOTE: Bugs in EQEmu are being fixed constantly, so I really don't see where your argument lies here

my arguement lies in the absolute absurdity of considering "legitimate" play with all the bugs currently in the emulator. There are far more bugs in it even now than EQLive when it was in the earliest Alpha. I promise you, "legit" players are going to get mighty sick of trying to go into zones the server isn't currently hosting, and having to wait hours (if not days) for someone with the proper status to kick them.


QUOTE: Some of us LIKE that time period of Live and can't get it anymore...even if we wanted to go to Live to enjoy pure legit play. I bet you never thought of this huh?

yeah, i thought of it, and i think it's a terrific idea. just too bad you can still play beastlords tho, but i bet you never thought of this, huh? too bad the luclin retextures were still there, but i bet you never thought of this, huh? too bad zones like stonebrunt and the warrens were there, except....oh that's right, they didn't go live until, what, after velious? but i bet you never thought of this, huh?

QUOTE: You're on some holier than thou crusade to piss on our enjoyment of the system.

no, i'm trying to open your eyes about how much this move toward legitimate play is going to piss on your enjoyment of the system.

QUOTE: all you're good for is coming here and bitching and moaning. That makes you pretty worthless in most people's eyes..including mine

you're certainly entitled to your opinion. why then are players sending me tells in game sharing my concerns? even on your precious legit servers.......

QUOTE: In fact the only reason I'm doing this is to hopefully give you a clue that some of us like legit for a reason and we don't have to explain ourselves to the like of you.

you don't have to explain to me......I ALREADY KNOW, and as i've said before, i understand. and if the EMU worked like the game, i would be right there with you playing on a legit server. but it doesn't. and despite what you may have heard or read or been promised, it won't anytime soon. EQEmu is an EMULATOR.....i can't stress that enough.

QUOTE: I do KNOW though that the evidence favors more LEGIT players as the supply and demand would indicate that.

the evidence being the inner circle of folks who frequently post on these boards (those same posters that have flamed me from the beginning no less). and since i started on about this, more and more anti legit players are speaking out.

QUOTE: Do you even help with the development of a server or the code at ALL?!? These people have lives you know..and it has been a huge task just to get to where we are now. Some of these folks have sacrificed thousands of man hours and dollars to bring this to us. They can't just fix things on a whim sometime. They have families, lives, jobs to attend to as well. Ungrateful ass! (remember, I deduced that your post was a flame, so I reserve the right to call you names )

then what gives them the right to start laying down rules and restrictions on a free server? oh that's right, because it's free, and because it's their server, and they can do anything they want. and just because you agree with it,,,,,,does that still make it right?

QUOTE:
GW has plenty of mobs and loot tables. Where did you look? Get your head out of your ass and maybe you'd see. Also, there were quite a few people leveling up legitimately using no bugs or exploits..even to level 50. I'm not saying there aren't any bugs out there...but sometimes you just have to alter things a bit to enjoy them without the bugs. Yes there is usually a way to work around any bug currently.

well first of all, my head is no where near my ass.....
second, sure there's way around bugs......it's called #level......it's called #summonitem 911.........it's called using whatever means necessary to get around the bugs.................yet you would still call it legit play.........and after those are gone, how are you going to work around those bugs?

QUOTE: I'll move on to the end now and ignore most of the rest of your idiocy..since it bears no meaning towards my issue here. Again, you have a holier than thou attitude:

if i have an attitude at all it's a "you're making a huge mistake" attitude.......

QUOTE: I don't enjoy the thousands of people competing over loot. IMHO a server is best with about a 50-75 playerbase. So, you're statement again, is false unimformed. You're making ASSumptions.

the only assumptions i see here are coming from you. also, it looks like no matter how this turns out you may come out on top, since you don't like a large player base. I feel confident in saying once legit play becomes standard, you certainly won't have to worry about large amounts of players competing for loot. but then again, what happens if there aren't enough to even make a group?..........the player base is small enough as it is. what you're looking at is a scenaio where you won't even have enough to handle Solb......

QUOTE: Honestly, noone really cares what you think...and I just wanted to stand up for what I believe in...not to come here and bring you down (although you must be smoking something..so come down please).


no, i'm not smoking anything. and you should be reminded that what YOU believe doesn't reflect what everyone else believes. I do respect legit players, something i haven't seen reciprocated from said legit players to non legit players.

QUOTE : It is possible to have a purely legit server...maybe not totally bug free..but Verant can't even lay claim to that either.

at least in Verant's world one can expect to still have access to the character they've worked many days/weeks/months/years to level. no such security exists on the emulator. and i'm not naive enough to expect a bug free world...........but right now we're looking at a bug-INFESTED world........

QUOTE: If you're not having fun...how is this my fault? Don't take your non-fun-having 5 year old attitude out on us...it's really quite pointless.

now who again has the five year old attitude?.......it's more than clear you're dead set in your opinions and views, and nothing anyone can say would even make you think about the other point of view. your lack of tolerance tho, is discouraging, and discouragingly similar among the majority of pro legit players. again, i have nothing against legit players; i would be among your ranks if i felt like it were worth my time and effort. it is not. and i'm afraid you will soon learn this for yourself.

i have a very very bad feeling that the days of EQEmu are numbered. it may still exist in name, but the spirit will soon be gone. pro legits debunk me when i say that legit play will destroy the fan base; that once people realize that they're getting a shoddy attempt at EQlive they'll split.

and, as always, the question "why encourage legitimate play when at the present time it is impossible to play legitimately?" is conveniently left unanswered, or responded to with a flame.

[Ben]

Banning is even better, I didn't think about it. IP banning is the best. I don't care how harsh it is, YOU SHOUDLNT HAVE BEEN CHEATING IN THE FIRST PLACE! The more that is to be lost means that more people will think twice about trying anything. Like I said before, if someone exploits and cheats, they are causing a whole servers worth of people headaches, so ban them. If they want to abuse free eq, they can get banned and go pay for it. Thats my view.

Ip banning is useless even on a forum, there are ways to get around it. First way is if they use a stable proxy, second way get a new ip. Getting a new ip is so easy to get though.

[Vermea]

I can't see any of the most recent posts...odd.

[Edge Suikendi]

Fyi an entire page of this forum has been deleted somehow, therefore I just altogether quit writing on it. Lots of the things you guys are pointing out have been talked about already. Go legit servers, they kick ass.

Those who MUST cheat are the ones who are too shitty at the game to play for real. Just remember that kids.

I'm sure Ragoo will have somethin to say about this cause he hates anything anyone else says.

[ShiftedReality]

You talk too much. Who gives a crap. Just don't play on the servers that you don't like, don't complain to all of eqemu that there are some bad servers, the eqemu devs only run what, 3 servers? stfu thx

[Liante_M]

So when guildwars is back up are there going to be factions, quests, etc. like eqlive? and are the quests going to be like eqlive's quests, or different ones?

[xelnagan]

Ugh... You know, I support playing either way, it's really your choice. But you shouldn't go around trying to hop your opinion on everyone else, it's really up to the person who runs the server.

- edit -

Fixed a typo.

[HLBobby]

I remember long ago, when EQEmu was made for those who wanted to feel what it was like to be the best. There was little or no thought about wanting it to be just like the live servers, cause why would you do that when you can just go on the live servers? I support non legit over legit, but I'm not gonna say legit sucks or anything. Non Legit is fun because you can just travel places, see the zones you never thought of seeing, see Gods without being killed in seconds and expirement a little with armor. I remember when I would always think of the perfect set of armor for my toon...which led me to go to EQPrices.Com, copy down the names of stuff I could acquire, and then summon it in EQEmu to test it out. I am sad to see that most of the non legit servers are gone and taken over by these legit newcomers, it almost makes me want to stop coming. The "LEGIT SERVERS SUCK Server" was my favorite, I could do anything, I saw Plane of Time and had lots of fun with the people. Then we had a legit person come in and burn us for being "cheaters", as he called it. I say that we should have a non legit server, and a legit one, as main servers I mean. GuildWars and a non legit server...plus everyone else's custom... but that's just my opinion...

[Nacleyen]

I agree. There should be two servers. I for one, enjoy the non-legit servers, just because it allows me to look at some of the zones I've never been to before. Some of the graphics still blow me away and this gives me the chance to look at them without fear of being annihilated. The Legit servers are great as well, as, I love a challenge. If there were two servers, I'd have a character on both, and I'd play each one about as equally.

I love what EQEMu has done. I'm going to take a gander at GuildWars, as I haven't been able to.

[Crythen]

I'm sorry to see Guild Wars go down. I just got level 50, Tboots, my epic, and some stuff off Vox and cazik. I wasn't an exploiter, I was bugged once, it went away the next day. I may have done some things I shouldn't have (accidental zone crash brings back Voxx for double raid in 5 minutes.. yay!) but I didn't exploit like most people are talking about.

It makes me sad that people would ruin this for others by trying deliberatly to exploit. I admit I had my evil side. Often times I wished the zone would crash to respawn a mob, or that a person would die and I'd be leaft to finish his job, but I didn't go about galavanting to make it happen. I'm sure Image has his reasons for this, I just think it's a bit extreem. I wish him well, and a speedy server recovery, but my suggestion would have been to start reviewing logs.

If you log someone taking quads of 60's (like from a fear mob) and he has no healer, and he is chain soloing them without anything but regen, you KNOW something's up. I realise, however, that the logs are VAST and would take HOURS to sort through when looking for general exploits. So I would propose that they announce that anyone caught cheating will be visited by a GM. They will get a chance to prove their case, and if they can't come up with a good reason why they didn't try and ask to get their bugged char fixed, temp ban for a few days. If they do it again, perma ban their account. Not too hard, is it? =)

Maby even give an option for people to 'snitch'. like a /report "i see &lt;nameofperson> killing reds w/o a healer and taking no damage.

Then the guide checks the logs and if its true, baddabam, their caught.


I don't know though, I'm just really sad that GW is down with no ETA for it going back up. I was hoping it'd be sometime tonight or tomorrow but I dbout it will. Hell, maby not even this/next week! Ugh.. 4 day weekend coming up too...

Image, please hurry man. I know you're peeved about the exploiters but.. agh! Us legit players back in! :P

&lt;sigh> &lt;cry> &lt;sob> &lt;sniffl> :(


Ah well, Image, we know you're doing whats best for your server. Thanks for putting up such a kickass server man, you're the best!

:worship:

--edit--
changed one of my stupid comments to a less stupid comment.

[darkion]

yeah cheating is bad and all, yadda yadda. I myself didnt cheat, but i still think you should leave the server up while you look for a solution rather than close it down meanwhile.
I mean a lot of people invested a good deal of time in your server, THEY TRUSTED YOU WITH THEIR TIME AND EFFORT, so you shouldn't just snatch it away from them like that. Just ban people who overuse exploits.
Anyways this is an ACCELERATED server, you level fast anyways, so someone cheats to lvl a bit faster. Not the end of the world, ban them and let the others lvl the normal 15 times as fast rather than 20 times like the cheaters.

[Crythen]

I guess the biggest issue we will all have with this is that many of us (including myself) spent a large portion of time invested into our characters. We made friends, gained items, formed guilds, and created a community. Now, without warning, on Image's whim, it's all gone. That doesn't mean that it won't be back eventually, it's just now we've lost something and were unprepared for the loss..

I respect Image's decision. It is his call what he wants to do with his server, it's HIS after all. Only next time, I, aswell as many others I'm sure, would appreciate fair warning before taking it down like this.

Hope to hear you on the boards a lot Image. It would be a good idea to post quite frequently (at least once every two days) keeping the public updated on your current progress. We should all like to know when GW will be back up. I think that, as much as anything, GW became a part of our EQ life much the same way a house is a part of my real one: It became a necessity to enjoy EQ gaming.

That's not to say that my life revolves around the game, but I did spend a lot of time with it. The community GW had was exceptional (once you got to know them 8) )

Ah well, guess I'll have to find something interesting to occupy my time. I hear theres this big dome thing, people call it a "outside". I don't know what they mean, but apparently it's realllly big and has this blue thing called 'sky', with a big ball of fire in it. And sometimes it has littler balls of fire with a giant chunk of glowing rock floating in it. I wonder if thats their Luclin? Hmm maby I will go exploring that realm... It seems to me that their could be some ub0r l00tz0rz to be had out there. But APPARENTLY you have to do it yourself, which means no computer monitor. I have yet to figure that concept out, but when I do I'll be sure to post a walkthrough here on the forums to help my brethren out! Who knows, maby we can get togethor and group! Hmmm, I wonder now if theres an emulated version of this "Outside". What version is it in? I don't wanna start paying to use it...

[Crythen]

Shut up Crythen!

&lt;me> ok

Good. Now that that's settled...

Heh, everyone here knows by now that GW is back up, under the leadership of MadCoyote. It seems that yes, Image did actually quit. Even though his post said Will be down for an undesclosed amount of time, showing that he planned to not quit, only take it down and work on it.

I must admit though, that when I got on I was appauled to see the HP regen bug rampent, and, yes, people were exploiting it without actually petitioning it. Many petitioned it I'm sure, but I know that some people went out of their way to try and get it back and then deliberatly exploited it (as in killing stuff they normally couldn't). I'd have THOUGHT they would have learned their lesson but... whatever. Sure, exploit all you want. It's not like THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT CAUSED IMAGE TO QUIT... assholes.

Another server to pop up using the GW database is Killspree's server. If you wish to make the transfer, however, you need to specifically request your characters be coded in. He didn't save the players database.

Alright, well, c'ya all in game!

8)

[Valdaor]

If EQEmu can team up with Sony then it would make EQEmu a whole new world of adventures.

[darkion]

Good points Raguel, very convincing for a stance supporting cheating. While I do agree with a lot of it, especially that part saying the instability of these servers makes it so it isn't really worth your time to play legit, I'd still have to disagree on the rest.

Although the server is indeed pretty unstable, and you are risking your time being thrown away by playing on it, some things have been done to counter this. For one thing, the GW server's EXP is accelerated, and it takes only a week at most to get lvl 50 from what I hear. The loot is also a bit picked up from what I've seen, and I think monsters are more likely to drop goodies.

As for another part of your post, concerning the reasons we came here, for all I know it may be true for the most part, but i think many others (like myself) came because we don't have EqLive anymore and want to get back to EQ after years of play. Thats why a server as similar to live as possible is preferred.

Well good post anyways, even though i disagree with a lot of it.
And don't don't bother trying to maturely discuss things with these kids that are flaming you, they don't understand anything past saying 'what are you smoking' or 'your head is up your ass' so its really pointless to introduce reasoning to them.

[Hipenis]

Guys...if you really want the MOST legitimate server...the BEST support and events...NO bugs...and no zone downage...

I suggest one thing.

EQLive

13 bucks a month is nothing, hell you probably spend more than that than the lotion you use every night for pleasure.

Maybe you wouldn't be torturing eachother with server issues.

[Dhamon15]

First, I would like to appologize for what I did and didn't do.

What I did do was exploit a bug that I had found when I had gone to make arrows with my ranger on GW .. I was able to make countless arrows with buying only a stack of each item that I needed.. I went on, figuring it out further .. and started making silvertiped arrows.. and made some pp from it...

What I didn't do was report it.. which is what I should have done as soon as I spotted it.. what really kept me from doing that is something about when I buy things from merchants, I seem to lose much more money then I should when buying from them... which kinda got to me at the time.

Again, I wish to appologize for that..

Sorry,
Dhamon

[DRod_1997]

i'm glad the GW server is back up. i Usually play it when i get bored on live. and the haxed servers are no fun because you don't have to work for anything... but oh well. i lost my level 29, Walwein, but that's okay because he had crap.

[PlasterMan]

Hullo there everyone, this is my -very- first post, so please be gentle with me if you find you must flame me or you have to defend yourself or if you are required to dismiss my post as a flame. Weeeeeeell, here goes:

I just recently found EQEmu, and you will probably call me a newbie for it, but whatever...I have been an EQ lover for a year now, and I despise the fee I have to pay for a fun online game which I go to roleplay at. It's ticked me off, of course, that Ver...er...Sony Online Entertainment has done such things, but they have a huge staff of people to pay who are constantly working on updates, expansions, and patches. Now then...onto this topic...

I just wasted about 30 minutes of my time listening to rants and flames and other such things, so here's what I think...I love Legit servers, BUT I enjoy the ability to summon armor, change levels, and all around help people enjoy the game as much as I do. I would gladly walk into Naggy's lair, inspect all the things going on, make a bug report, spawn Naggy and up his loot maybe just a little bit...then have a bunch of people come and whomp him while I smile and watch them, then maybe enjoy a bit of roleplaying afterwards.

I enjoyed EverQuest because I could be with my real life friends, while meeting other people online and making new friends. I think that many people complain way too much without realizing how privledged they are already. No one has the right to flame on this board right now...Everyone here is darn lucky that Sony hasn't sued EQEmu for copyrights or stealing customers. We have the ability to choose servers, even if they are unstable, make our own characters, summon items and uber lewt [if non-legit], or you get to have your own character in which to run around in a VAST area with friends or by yourself...How many of us can visit a tree city in which the guards smile and gladly dispose of any creature chasing you? None [I hope :D ].

You must all remember, this is a game, made for enjoyment and the feeling of success in one thing. I will be making my own server soon, named the Soaring Wind server, it will be legit, but I will happily appoint GMs and help anyone who needs it. Now then, I must get back to my computer class...good luck everyone, I hope my server will be fun for you all to play on :wink:

[PlasterMan]

...I must be a newb...I was posting about the flamers on page two...heh heh :oops: :oops: :oops:

[a_Guest03]

This topic is tired. Legit/illegit really doesn't matter. To be honest, there is no discussion. If you like one, host it. If you like the other, host it.