A small problem with Drawde's NPCs

[Sterbla]

Hi there,

I've recently started looking for an EQ server emu after having quit the game I've played for 3 years. I got it all up and running and am now messing with different DBs to get something that's ok to play :p.

I'm using Drawde's DB and have noticed that there is a problem with NPC damage. I don't know if it is known but I didn't see a post about this on the boards:

The NPC "min damage" field is actually the NPC's maximum damage. I.e. a Hill giant at level 37 can hit for 97 points of damage max on live servers.

It seems as if the DB has the mob's actual max damage as the min damage and is roughly doubling this value for the max damage field.

**EDIT**
I.e. a Hill Giant can hit for up to about 200 points of damage.
**EDIT**

As said above I don't know if this is intended...just thought it strange that a lvl 35 mob can hit for more than 150 points of damage at times.

[a_Guest03]

Combat is under construction. If you know correct values, submit them.

[Drawde]

Part of the reason for this is that AC damage reduction doesn't work with the 4.4dr1 binaries I posted.
The damage formula still needs fixing, but as I've said before, I need to wait until AC is working again before I can fix it; if the hill giant's actual maximum damage was 97, then it would be reduced by AC to a much lower value.
Or is the max damage of 97 for a character with low AC?

[Trumpcard]

Once a_guest gets all the damage formulas pegged down, we're going to put them in.

The latest CVS code has a new damage mitigation formula that BigPull implemented though.

[Sterbla]

A Hill Giant's max damage of 97 would be on a character with 0 AC or of much lower level than the HG. Also a player sitting is considered level 1 with 0 AC in EQLive as mobs will usually go after them first when pulled and also most of the time hit with the maximum of attacks they can do in one round (i.e. a double hit plus a kick or bash from a Hill Giant)

The main problem - and it is being worked on here from what I've read - is that AC and AGI along with the defensive skills affect firstly IF the mob can hit the player and secondly for HOW MUCH. However, any mob can "pierce" through a player's defense, thus hitting for full damage if the player's "mitigation roll" fails.

For detailed numbers on mitigation I can't help much...I've played a cleric to level 61 and a necro to level 57 and neither class had really good AC nor mitigation (cleric had an AC of roughly 1000 and most mobs could squish her with ease). However it is known that different classes are on different mitigation and "AC benefit" tables:

-Tanks (warrior, pally, SK) - have the highest mitigation and "AC benefit"
-Melee (ranger, rogue, monk, beast lord) - have a worse mitigation than the tanks. Worse enough that they often can't main tank in a regular group (except the monk but that is due to the "block" skill)
-Priests (cleric, druid, shaman) - lowest "AC benefit" with the casters; mitigation is also deplorable
-Casters (chanter, necro, mage, wizzy) - lowest "AC benefit" along with priests but also slightly lower mitigation

I hope I didn't forget any class :p

By the way, if mitigation and AC have to be done from scratch then would it be possible to tie it to the armor type of a class? Optimum would be to directly tie it to the armor worn but that seems impossible. Doable might however be to tie it to a player's favourite armor type. This would mean that mitigation would be sorted about like this, from highest to lowest mitigation:

-Plate class (warrior, pally, SK, cleric) - the tanks have better defensive skills than the cleric so they will always be hit less than the cleric
-Chain class (ranger, shaman, rogue) - same as above
-Leather class (monk, Beast Lord, Druid) - monks have the best defensive skills to avoid damage; with the efficiency of block they take much less damage than their fellow leather users and can still do some pulling
-Cloth class (mage, chanter, wizzy, necro) - paper armor doesn't really soften a blow, so they are down here :p

Those are just a few thoughts and small, tiny bits from how I think EQLive works. I don't know if and when such things have been discussed or if they are doable at all. If it's mostly nonsense for current developpement issues then ignore it. If it is of any help then I'm glad to have been of use, though not much.

[Drawde]

Hmm, if 97 is the max damage for a hill giant (level 35) attacking a character with 0 AC, then the formula would be roughly 2+(level*2.7). I'll try using that formula.
The formula I used in my last DB release was 2+(level*4.5), currently I'm using level*3.25.

I do think that it would be an improvement to make mitigation and AC benefit based more on armour type (the class's preferred type, not the actual type being worn, that would be very hard to determine since there are so many items) than class, but I suppose it's more important for the basic EQEmu code to be as accurate to EQLive as possible. Maybe put both systems in and allow them to be switched between with a server variable?

[Sterbla]

The formula you've come up would alas only be valid for a certain range of mob levels. I think your formula covers about the damage of all mobs up to level 45. After level 45 I'd suggest just incrementing the multiplier a bit:

lvl 46 to 49: x3
lvl 50 to 53: x3.5
lvl 54: x4
lvl 55: x4.5
lvl 56 to 59: x5
lvl 60 to 64: x6.5
lvl 65+: x8

**EDIT**
Mobs past level 45 do get a substantial damage boost in EQLive. Damage incrementing is only linear for certain levels, then you usually get a substantial boost that is linear through a few levels and followed by yet another substantial boost. Quite a few mobs do also have "customized" damage values on EQLive, such as for example the snakes in Ssra Temple who hit for more than other mobs of the same levels.
**EDIT OFF**

These values should make the tougher mobs (lvl 55+ and especially lvl 60+) more challenging whilst still leaving a fairly logic raise in damage as the mobs get higher level. For some special named like Lord Vyemm, AoW, Aerin'Dar etc damage values of 500+ (less for caster mobs, more for pure melee ones) should propably be set manually. This would mean fiddling manually with the dmg values of up to a few hundreds of mobs though. The idea here is that a "miniboss" should do more damage than a regular mob of the same level and a "real boss" should do even more than a miniboss. This would make some encounters more diverse than just a change in mob HP and appearance :p.

By the way, does anyone know if resistances have been implemented yet?

[Bigpull]

if (mylevel >= 28 && mylevel <= 39) {
if (min_dmg==0)
min_dmg = mylevel / 2; // 14-17
if (max_dmg==0)
max_dmg = (mylevel*2)+2;
// 28 = 58, 39 = 80
}


If you do not set mindmg and maxdmg in the database this is the formula used. So level a level 37 npc hits for a minimum of 18 (note should be 19 we don't round everything up like live) and a maximum of 76

Now you may be thinking this is abit low but keep in mind that attack and str aren't factored.

So..

max_dmg = max_dmg + ( (str/10) * 2)
min_dmg = min_dmg + ( (str/10) * 2)


which gives your HG
str 105
min 40
max 97

Buffed with: Strength of the Diaku (lvl 63 shm) str buff 75
str 180
min 55
max 112

Buffed with: Yaulp II (clr 19/pal 39) close enough str buff 20
str 125
min 44
max 101

The default is 75 for stats so after the code addition
str 75
min 34
max 91