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  #1  
Old 10-15-2008, 08:31 PM
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trevius
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Ya, I vaguely remember something about you making Dex so that it effected proc chance. Probably around the time you were working on Agi helping with mitigation.

So, we could have a base proc chance and it could still be 5, but if so, I don't think we should be adding the dex bonus to that. Maybe we could meet in the middle and lower the base 5% addition down to 4% and reduce the bonuses from Dex by alot. Maybe something like this:

Code:
ProcChance = 0.04f + float(mydex) / 20000.0f;
I think that would be much more reasonable for both high and low end.
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  #2  
Old 10-16-2008, 01:06 AM
ChaosSlayer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trevius View Post
Ya, I vaguely remember something about you making Dex so that it effected proc chance. Probably around the time you were working on Agi helping with mitigation.

So, we could have a base proc chance and it could still be 5, but if so, I don't think we should be adding the dex bonus to that. Maybe we could meet in the middle and lower the base 5% addition down to 4% and reduce the bonuses from Dex by alot. Maybe something like this:

Code:
ProcChance = 0.04f + float(mydex) / 20000.0f;
I think that would be much more reasonable for both high and low end.

umm /20000....

thsi means with each 100 dex my proc improves by what 0.005?
thsi means even with whopping 500 dex, i have only + 0.025 , which basicly +2.5%....

imho the worth of dex in proc should be atleast 4 times as much. (this stat is allreday nearly worthless compared to STR), not to mention IMHO dex should boost To Hit chance

even better put into Rules what is DEX worth =)


PS. Its abotu time we add a Rule to boost people "To Hit chance" I am getting sick of "you have missed" fest -my level 5 ranger only lands like 1 hit out of each 10, and fact that hybrids capped at like 55% chance to hit for LIVE - kind of suck

ALSO, since we have CLient, NPC and warrior base Critical Chance Rule, why nto add same rule for spells critical? For Client (all classes), for mobs, and separatly for Wizards
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  #3  
Old 10-16-2008, 01:59 AM
KLS
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I don't see what's wrong with the proc formula we have other than it not calculating bonus effects right of course.
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  #4  
Old 10-16-2008, 05:59 AM
KLS
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Ok I went through it and will be uploading some changes. The formula for current procs stays, I feel it offers enough of a % to proc rate that while you wont want to stack dex over str it wont feel like a wasted stat. The 5% lets people leveling up with proccing weapons feel like they aren't worthless.

AA's will no longer LOWER the chance to proc. Bonuses *should* work.
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  #5  
Old 10-16-2008, 07:52 AM
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trevius
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Don't forget about this:

Code:
			case SE_ProcChance:
			{
				//multiplier is to be compatible with item effects
				//watching for overflow too
				effect_value = effect_value<3000? effect_value * 10 : 30000;
				if(newbon->ProcChance < effect_value)
					newbon->ProcChance = effect_value;
				break;
			}
With that multiplying by 10, it makes proc spell bonuses in your equation at 10X more than they should be.

Other than that, it looks to be basically the same as what I was writing. After going over the code again and again, the AA bonus wasn't causing the chance to be less, it was actually just adding 25% of the base procchance to the bonus, which is essentially the same thing that you and I have been writing in different ways. It just looked confusing the way it was before lol.

Combining how you and I wrote it, I think this is about as simple as it can get and it still does the same thing:

attack.cpp
Code:
	ProcBonus += float(itembonuses.ProcChance + AABonus + (spellbonuses.ProcChance / 10)) / 100.0f;
	
	ProcChance = float(mydex) / 10000.0f;
	ProcChance += (ProcChance * ProcBonus);

	mlog(COMBAT__PROCS, "Proc chance %.2f (%.2f from bonuses)", ProcChance, ProcBonus);
	return ProcChance;
And that also means you would have to set the AABonus code back to this:

Code:
		switch(CastToClient()->GetAA(aaWeaponAffinity)) {
			case 1:
				AABonus = 5;
				break;
			case 2:
				AABonus = 10;
				break;
			case 3:
				AABonus = 15;
				break;
			case 4:
				AABonus = 20;
				break;
			case 5:
				AABonus = 25;
				break;
		}
	}
And, really, we could remove the 10 divider for the spellbonuses.ProcChance if we just removed the multiplier in the case SE_ProcChance

zone/bonuses.cpp
Code:
                        case SE_ProcChance:
                        {
                                //multiplier is to be compatible with item effects
                                //watching for overflow too
                                effect_value = effect_value<3000? effect_value * 10 : 30000;
                                if(newbon->ProcChance < effect_value)
                                        newbon->ProcChance = effect_value;
                                break;
                        }
though, the code you have will work perfectly fine once you get the spell bonus divided by 10 or remove it from the SE_ProcChance.

I do agree that dex is nice to be able to factor into procs so it actually does something. I just think that the base calculations need to be tweaked a little further. Even if their base is only a total of 5% (after dex is calculated), that is still 1 in 20 hits, which should be about 1 in 10 rounds or less after double attack and dual wield (if they have 2 procing weapons) are factored in. IMO, that isn't too bad at all for someone with no AAs, 100ish dex, and no item or spell bonuses. Maybe I should cap Combat Effects down to 25 max instead of 50 on my server. Even still, with the base being set that high, even my players agree that proc rates were way too much once you are geared and have the AAs.

I have run through this equation with different parameters dozens of times now. The base is the only thing that can really be adjusted here. It is really close to being good, but a bit of tweaking would help.

I am currently using this:
Code:
ProcChance = 0.04f + float(mydex) / 20000.0f;
And that definitely seems more reasonable in the very high end. It also doesn't make a huge difference in the very low end.

With that base equation, here are some example of what base proc rate would be:

100 Dex = 4.5%
200 Dex = 5%
255 Dex = 5.3%
305 Dex = 5.5%
355 Dex = 5.8%
380 Dex = 5.9% (almost a 50% increase)
471 Dex = 6.4%

And, with your equation:

100 Dex = 6.1%
200 Dex = 7.2%
255 Dex = 7.8%
305 Dex = 8.3%
355 Dex = 8.9%
380 Dex = 9.2%
471 Dex = 10.2% (over a 200% increase)

If you get the AA maxed and only 25 combat effect bonuses, it will jump up 50% higher than that, which means 471 goes to over 15% chance. Then factor in quad attacks with 2 procing weapons and it will be procing every round or 2. Not to mention if the weapon is augmented with a procing aug.
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  #6  
Old 10-16-2008, 01:08 PM
ChaosSlayer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trevius View Post

And that definitely seems more reasonable in the very high end. It also doesn't make a huge difference in the very low end.

With that base equation, here are some example of what base proc rate would be:

100 Dex = 4.5%
200 Dex = 5%
255 Dex = 5.3%
305 Dex = 5.5%
355 Dex = 5.8%
380 Dex = 5.9% (almost a 50% increase)
471 Dex = 6.4%

And, with your equation:

100 Dex = 6.1%
200 Dex = 7.2%
255 Dex = 7.8%
305 Dex = 8.3%
355 Dex = 8.9%
380 Dex = 9.2%
471 Dex = 10.2% (over a 200% increase)

If you get the AA maxed and only 25 combat effect bonuses, it will jump up 50% higher than that, which means 471 goes to over 15% chance. Then factor in quad attacks with 2 procing weapons and it will be procing every round or 2. Not to mention if the weapon is augmented with a procing aug.
Trev an IMPORTANT note- on your server from what I know you giving people who hunt in say VP a gear which of Elemental+ level, and peopel who hunt in Elementals get a gear from GoD/Oow and so on.
No wonder your guys have WAY TOO MUCH DEX on their hand

On server with +stat progression close to classic/peq getting to 200 DEX is a LONG PATH of seeking out +dex gear. And 300 DEX you won't see untill you hit Elemetal plains.

I had VERY twinked lev 65 Bard on Live during OoW era obssesed over DEX and procs (pre-elemetal flagged)- I was lucky to get even to to 275 DEX

essentialy people bitween 75 and 200 dex range have to build up their dex for 50-60 levels before they see any sort of benefit from it, which imho is BAD.
You should feel as proc % increase for every 25 dex not every 100

AND another important thing- high end peopel WILL always proc A LOT no matter how muhc you nerf AA, dex, or effects - simply cuase they have everything nearly maxed out.
My worry is for lev low people who should be given soemthing of VALUE while they leveling in their teens, 20s, 30s, not AFTER they get to lev 70. In other words- in good mmo "the game" should starts at lev 1, not at 50+
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  #7  
Old 10-16-2008, 03:58 PM
KLS
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I was sure to go through the numbers being outputted and make sure they were right, which was actually how I noticed AA's were removing chance to proc.
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  #8  
Old 10-16-2008, 03:59 PM
So_1337
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Quote:
On server with +stat progression close to classic/peq getting to 200 DEX is a LONG PATH of seeking out +dex gear. And 300 DEX you won't see untill you hit Elemetal plains.
It's a lot easier than that, actually. Any melee with a primal is going to see +100 to all their melee stats from the Avatar proc, not to mention most well-rounded Luclin gear (Ssra and VT) carrying a healthy bonus. Vengeful Mail of the Void, and so forth.
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