New Years resolutions anyone?

[cavedude]

Thank you Angelox for your very kind words. We have tried to bulldoze the entire database, correcting bugs as we go. We have slowed a little bit I must admit at the moment, but mostly because we are all working on longer term mini projects that can't be finished in a matter of hours.

Zengez, I'm sorry but a full database release is not going to happen right now. It is in the works and it will happen soon but we feel it is just not ready yet. I am hoping for a release in another 1 - 2 months. This will incooperate our massive changes to Luclin and below, all of the original epics, many other freshly added quests, a tweaked VT (with the key quest), a tweaked PoK, and if I get to it in time, a tweaked PoT. But, here's how I see it... FNW released his last version of Luclin in December. Even we make a release in 2 months, that is still only 3 months or so inbetween releases. That I think is the fastest update in PEQ history. Why is it not coming out until those goals are met? Support is the number one issue. I WILL receive support quests and there isn't anything that can be done to stop that. Secondly, without goals, people tend to sit on things forever. We are all itching to release the database but knowing that we won't until our goals are met keeps us motivated. Quicker updates will hope to be the norm. Possibly instead of a full PoP release, we'll have Luclin 1.5 with half of the PoP zones done and perhaps LoY.

What's to stop you from helping now? Download the Luclin Final http://projecteq.net/downloads.php You actually have access to the newest quests now, using anonymous CVS login: http://sourceforge.net/cvs/?group_id=127915 Then, check out the PEQ forums: http://projecteq.net/phpBB2/ Our players submit bugs and suggestions everyday. Browse through and see what you may want to take on. You can also login into the PEQ server, to see the db in action. Using the Luclin final as a guide, create the .sql files and post them on the MySQL submission board. You don't need access to the current database to help.

[John Adams]

Originally Posted by cavedude

You don't need access to the current database to help.

I'm sensing this is actually the root issue here.

I can't wait to see the new database!

[bufferofnewbies]

Originally Posted by Zengez

instead going back and replacing missing doors in zone xyz that nobody really needs in the first place... Get all the essential stuff in, then worry about doors and who is selling what (no offense intended to those that did these, it's still more than alot of other people, and I have nothing but respect to anyone that does any work on the database).

ouch, kinda. Just as a pre-emptive statement: I don't take offense at this remark, although i do feel a bit slighted. I'm certain you didn't mean anything bad by it, due to your last sentence there. So no harm, no foul.

BUt I do want to help everyone with what I can do and when it comes to

Originally Posted by Zengen

it seems such a waste to me to see people that could be doing real work on the spawns and loot and factions and whatnot of a database

I really have no skill with that when it comes to 'live-like' qualities. Thus I attempt to fill in the spaces for those who will come later who do have the skills necessary: To lessen their work when it comes time for those areas to be filled. I find most of my modifications/ additions can be used by the majority of the community, and not just the PEQ team, as they are changes to empty or un-finished areas. Thus, I put out my modifications here instead of anywhere else, and in a format that is the 'least' restrictive to databases that I can achieve.

Some of us would like to be a part of the PEQ team, but I'm sure I am not the only one that doesn't apply simply because we do not feel we have anything to offer other than what we currently have produced. And as most of that isn't 'world-specific', there really is no need to have my name anywhere but in the minds of those who are doing the real work. I hope that if they come across a situation that I have proven myself capable of they ask for my assistance, since the worst I can do is say no.

It's also a good point to note that quite a few of us are only here for short periods of time on and off. I have been a member of this community for quite a bit longer than I have been posting these updates, but as is always in life: I get burned out/ distracted and fail to return for months or so.

Originally Posted by Cavedude

The best way to help is by dropping changes on the PEQ forums.

As a jokeing aside comment: Does this mean I need to start linking my threads from here to PEQ boards?

[cavedude]

I just say to post on the PEQ forums because it is easier for us. Both the EQEmulator and PEQ forums seem to have the same number of active users (ok, so maybe Emu edges out out a bit) so it's tough to find time to browse both forums looking for cool additions. PEQ has a nice and neat MySQL submission forum setup here: http://www.projecteq.net/phpBB2/viewforum.php?f=38 so that would help us out a ton. Plus, if the changes are made for PEQ then to me it only makes sense to use our forums. I always felt the EQEmulator.net forums were more meant for the code and just a general meeting place for all community members.

[Angelox]

Well, I like the work that's going on over there at PEQ, Lots of activity, and I'm sure they will put out a new database when they are ready. From what I've seen, Cavedude never had anything to hide, gave us his Eq database, and I'm sure he'll give us PEQ when it's done too. My biggest worry was that my hard work would get lost in a pile of "waiting to be inspected" lists, I also thought I would never see stuff like the LoY zones, unless I did it myself - this is not so anymore.
Fact of matter is, we really are not giving Cavedude and his "revised" PEQ project a chance. Currently, there is nothing more organized than PEQ ( and never was). And my original idea, may very well be just another "pipe dream".
I am NOT that organized - I am just one guy that proved to you all what one dumd-assed MySql, Perl illiterate can accomplish - at the time i started, PEQ or nobody else was doing nothing (Most like Cavedude, were "retired"), void FNW , who was working on the source.
Originally, I started this thread as a plea to get something more done to the public DB. There's not really a lot of people willing to do do this, and what few there are , need to stick together. I'm willing to to go over and help PEQ in whatever way I can, hope you all will too.
Keep in mind, there "each ship can only have one skipper", so we can't go in there "bossing" everyone around.

[Zengez]

Originally Posted by bufferofnewbies

It's also a good point to note that quite a few of us are only here for short periods of time on and off. I have been a member of this community for quite a bit longer than I have been posting these updates, but as is always in life: I get burned out/ distracted and fail to return for months or so.

Amen to this on so very many levels, and this is absolutely the primary reason I haven't already tried to join the PEQ team, because I simply am not confident that I won't gravitate elsewhere by choice or necessity for a long stretch of time...

But let me just say that I think several people may have taken my ... fervor... a little too intensly. I think what this project has accomplished is mind boggling, and the database as of now is remarkable and advancing in good order, or from what I hear.

I am also quite please Cavedude is the leader of the PEQ crew, he did alot of good work on many database things that I've toyed with and I have great respect for him and what he has done.

Read above and replace Cavedude with Angelox; you are right up there with the others despite what you say.

Now to the point, I post what I did, and am, because I think that it is a very largely held belief right now that nobody wants to say. As such, I took it upon myself to be the voice of those that wouldn't speak up and bring the issue front and center. Many of the topics I myself wholeheartedly agree with, such as at least some form of public release or wider release of a rougher database to generate interest...

However some of what I have said I don't necessarily wholeheartedly agree with but I thought it needed to be said, so that we had a discussion on exactly why things are the way they are, and what is/is not changing. Thus far I think I've accomplished what I set out to do and that is why I'm writing this now... This isn't a retraction by any means but I just wanted to make my postition clear so everyone doesn't think I'm being negative on the project or those that are pushing it, it's quite the opposite.

All that being said, let me continue with the topic at hand however. I guess all I'd really want to see is an explicit example of what you guys think can be accomplished under the parameters you have set, by those of us outside the team with access to the database... Here's what I see and I'm sure there has got to be more to it otherwise this wouldn't be such a debateable issue;

Ok, Under the current setting;

1) People log into PEQ and get an idea for how the world works, keeping in mind live and whatnot, jot down any issues they may have and anything they notice lacking for content and whatnot.
2) People then go code crawling and figure out how the database really works by posting questions, and looking at the newest released database (something in favor of this, the database will be clean and thus not quite as confusing to the newbins)
3) Once the person has a feel for how things work and what goes where, they proceed to fix the things they noticed were missing/off and then post fixes in the forums explaining what/why/how/where/etc...
4) Rinse and repeate.

Ok, perfectly good in theory, now here's what I see under an opened release of the database:

1) Exact same thing as above as none of that would be thus unavailible due to having more things to work with...
2) Added, people could look through the zones they are most familiar with... those that went through Wall of Slaughter all the time would be able to see the progression with Wall of Slaughter instead of being limited to the velious or newer zones, thus they would be able to work with what they know, and have a better understanding/refference for picking out what is missing/off...
3) with more familiarity comes more interesting in fixing it, which in result leads to more activity and posts with updates, which then fixes the database faster and more efficiently.
4) potential downside is the newbins that try and fail and flood people with support/bad ideas/ etc... See above with the liason/intermediary for answer.


Ok, so is that it? What else am I missing here? Let the talk continue!


PS:: bufferofnewbies, I actually was extatic to hear about the door update because I liked to close doors on my friends to mess them up when we played hide and seek in empty PoK... So I was speaking of generality more than anything else, and like I said, nothing but respect