Non-combat mob regen

[gernblan]

Does anyone knwo how to make it actually work? No matter what I set mob regen to in npc_types, mobs just dont' want to regen when in non-combat (like if a group wipes OR a monk FDs).

Because I cannot seem to get mobs to regenerate fairly quickly when in non-combat, monks, for example, can literally defeat ANYTHING on the server. All they have to do is hit the mob until they are low on health, mend or whatever, and when they need to, just FD, regen back up while the mob DOES NOT... then fight again, rinse and repeat until the mob is dead.

Our most powerful bosses can easily be soloed by monks this way.

HOW can I stop this? Does anyone have any idea?

Thank you.

I didn't post this in bugs because I'm not sure it IS one.. maybe I am just not understanding something.

Any advice is appreciated.

OH, I'd also love to know how to reduce the AC soft cap for a class... is there a way to do it? I mean, if it's in the code (which I am sure it is) could someone please tell me where so that I can tweak it and recompile?

[John Adams]

Comment out the FD code. That'll fix those squirrely monks!

;)

[KLS]

Ima look into this, I've gotten reports about this from PEQ as well.

I believe if there's a softcap it would be in the calcAC methods, tho the client calcs AC on it's own (hp, atk, endurance and mana too!) so if you change the ac calculations they wont match up to client, not that it really matters.

[TheLieka]

I've been meaning to look into this on my server also. My issue wasn't with monks, as much as normal raid mobs being taken out of persistent groups.

If a group can do 30-40% damage to a mob, then wipe, they can just do that 3-4 times to get the loot. It's extremely annoying when trying to tweak encounters. Once I figured out what they were doing, it made more sense.

So yeah, I'm also very interested in seeing the out-of-combat regen for mobs adjusted. On EQLive, mobs would heal back to full after less than 30 seconds-ish of no aggro, right?

Dax

[John Adams]

If I remember correctly, long ago (around Luclin time?) mobs didn't regen so fast... since I was in one of those "wipes so often" guilds, and our nemesis were always standing by to engage our mobs after we dropped. :) I remember vividly the NPC camping our corpses for at least a few minutes before wandering back to it's spawn point, and slowly regenerating it's health.

But lately, you are correct. Combat ends, mob sits there for 30 or so seconds, then runs back to it's spawn point fully healed. At least I think so. I haven't died in EQ1 recently. :)

[Magoth78]

When I coded the bots's raid, I've tested them on an online server with some friends. I've noticed that defeating any target was doable because of theses non-combat regens. What you had to do is to spawn your bots, create your raid, attack your target while you were hidding around. Then, once all your bots were dead, you spawned them again, created your raid and attacked your target. At the end, you won..

To change that, and to give a real challenge, I've added a WoW like regen. If the mob isn't engaged, it is fully healed. It's easily doable by updating the Mob::AI_Process() function in the "I'm not engaged" part.

Now, as it's giving a real challenge, it's not like Live. I even don't know how it works on Live theses days. When I played, though, I remember that the regens weren't so fast.

[sfisque]

i can say, up to the release of LDON, mob regens out of combat were probably in the range of 3-5 x what toons would regen.

i played a monk for several years on and off, and using FD was only good for getting out of combat so you could bandage up and try again, from 100% mob health.

i'm not sure if they changed that after LDON.

the only way i know of FD kiting (back then) being even remotely usable was if you had several regens stacked on the monk (e.g. fungi, sham/dru regen, augments, AA's, etc.)

a realistic out of combat regen rate that would mimic close to Live (back then) and remove the FD kiting exploit would probably be in that range (x3 to x5 or so, give or take).

== sfisque

[KLS]

Regen's not being loaded properly from the DB, I'll also add a rule or something for a % OOC regen or something when I fix it.

[gernblan]

Yes, regen values from the db working properly would go a long way towards helping this situation.

Thank you.

[gernblan]

Just make it a set percentage of the mob's total hit points per tic, then it will scale along with the mobs but always be the same "amount"...

[KLS]

Aye was thinking something like 4/5% per tic default. Two minutes to go from 0-100%.

[gernblan]

That's wonderful, and if you make it a configurable rule (I'd have mine set at 10% if I could, I want uber fast regen to counter the fact that monks are all screwed up on the emu and way way way overpowered, so a soling monk, FD, I want them to get hammered by mob regen), it would be perfect. :)

Also, KLS, just throwing this out there, you may want to make sure the doesn't affect pets too. Dunno why, but something tells me that it could.

[gernblan]

Actually, a switch that also allows it to affect pets might not be a bad thing for solo servers... some may think that hey, if the pet survives, it deserves a downtime regen. I for one would probably switch it on... :)

[John Adams]

Actually, if it could be on a per-mob basis, that would be best, don't you think? What if you want some mobs to regen faster, some slower? Or is that what the mobs individual Regen values would use as a base, then use the new "rule" percentage to offset that?

[gernblan]

Well yes John you are right. It WOULD be best. But a LOT of work.

What about a global rule value that IF a value for it in the db is anything other than 0 (positive or negative like attackspeed) overrides?

That being said, this is a major problem on EMU servers (makes monks pretty much unkillable) so I'd rather see a global thing that can be done quickly and not stress out the programmers instead of having to wait for a long time to have a more complex implementation.

[John Adams]

Yes, a lot of work, and no I am not saying a dev should fix DB mob regen rates - just how they effect the proposed rule. If we think about it, admins could get a generic "this is how it is... 5% per level" or whatever by default. But should I want all my boss mobs to be 20% per level, I simply go to my npc_types table and make the changes on MY server according to my desires. Nothing to do with dev coding. I am thinking that the hp_regen and mana_regen in the npc_types table is already there, let's use it as an offset instead of "regen xx mana per tick", as I think it is now(?)

[gernblan]

Those fields are different though.. when they work, they are for regen all the time (including during combat).

So, since non-combat mob regen is a different thing, it would require a new field in the db, changes to all of the tools that work with mobs, as well as code to chech the db value and override the rule if it's different. Or it could be set up as whatever the value is in the db is the percentage of total hitponts the mob will regen in one tic. 0 is off, and a float value could determine.

Either way though, it becomes a lot more complicated.

I'm not saying it's a bad idea, just explaining that this can be a simple fix in the code, or a huge project. At least for now, since this is such a critical showstopping problem (I'd go so far as to say it can be an exploit) not to have it, I'd rather see the simple fix fast than the "complete system" done eventually.

[TheLieka]

Any fix to this will be a vast improvement, I'm so glad that I remerged my code with the source (aside from our custom stuff anyway). This fix will sooo make my day. =)

Dax

[TheLieka]

I am posting my fix for this in the code submissions forum. I put in a variable for it, so you can turn it off / adjust it if you want.

Dax

[TheLieka]

Updated this for a Rules-based fix (rather than a variable-based fix), as requested by CaveDude.

Dax