The dream of Classic EQ - and why it doesn't work.

[Sladdaya]

I'm working on a server as well...right now, I'm leaning toward getting rid of the Nexus and PoK at the very least, gah how I despise those zones, I want it to be somewhat classic, but with a lot of custom content...I want to re-experience the magic and make EQ my own.

Umm, I know this isn't the place for it, but since I mentioned my server and all, any chance there's any way to change how auto-attack works? I'm assuming it's hardcoded, but if it's not, I'd like to make it more interactive....pressing Q....or in my case A is just...well....boring. Not expecting to be able to do it, just very hopeful, lol.

[bbum]

circle of elements is a full old world remake, including old world game mechanics, with custom content and quests and npcs text as well. so you shoudl help us

BUT most of the people who claim they want it back will get bored within a week and drop the server for a semi-legit or a legit where its easier to LV.

we got 97 reigstered useers on our forum at eqclassic.com and its only been up like a week! if even half of those peopel played that would be enought to make the server feel alive, old world is pretty damn small.

i think theres tons of people like me, who dont give a sh* about eq emu, or even the eqlive, but would still play a pre-kunark server, but maybe not =/

i think wiz should have a poll on his server about weather he should continue wr or a eq remake lol

[Wiz]

let me rephraise a few things wiz, since english isnt your first language you probly translate alot of the text wrong ( ive seen people like you on the net, they know engllish perfectly by the dictionary and kno every word in the universe and talk like a professer, but cant understand a damn sentence.)

Superiority through condenscating tone does not work. If anything, you're the one that is butchering your own language.

what i said was no planar armor for a few months lol, anyway, i didnt even get 50 till kunark came out, i never had the pleasure of reaching 50 and waiiting around for kunark. perhaps thats why i would like to play old world again, and you would not, because i didnt fully expierence it eheh.

Yeah, planar armor is what I meant too.

its not hard when there ubar. any kind of stat gear should be considered leet. thats the point of the servr, if you like how eq is now where you dont even check if items are magic anymore than have fun.

+2 DEX is still like 0.1% proc rate. Try not to quote so incredibly selectively. Point not refuted.

wr is your ideal image of eq? lol thats lame man, lame.

Personal attack. WR is my project that is aiming towards my ideal image of EQ. It is far from complete. I refer you back to argumentative school, because you fail on the quiz.

i dont yearn for EQlive. EQlive is the pos made by the EQlive team after mcquaid went to sigil and trost/ smedley and the rest went to wrok on eq2

and i go on live all the time and do quests without allakazam, its fun, if people want to ruin there fun they can.

I'm pretty sure you know what I meant. You yearn for the original EQlive. You're just arguing a different point than what I said (people WILL use allakhazam) because you can't refute that one.

the point is, obtaining those items on an original server would be an acomplishment, its ubah, while on a live server would be something you sell to a merchant as junk. not to mention lvl 20 on a live server is nothin but a day at paludal, and for the first 10 lvls you dont have to worry about any risk or challenge at all.

No, killing a giant snake is not much of an accomplishment at all. It might be a decently useful lowbie item, but knowing what I know now, I could easily get 20 in a day on a Classic server that perfectly emulated EQclassic.

you know the answer to all 3. i wont waste my time.

Yup, I do.

ah god damn stfu u kno exactly what i mean lol

So? It still wasn't logical, it was an appeal to nostalgia. I could apply that to anything, for example:

"We still haven't had a REAL milennia shift for four years, so I suggest we set back all calendars to 1999 again."

thats not the whole quote and is taken out of contex.. you were saying eq original would not be as fun if we played now. now read my quote

Yes, I did. And I backed up my point with a lot of logic that you have yet to refute. And the rest of the quote was ad hominems, so I think I did you a favor in taking it "out of context". You claimed a paragraph consisting of two ad hominems and a single statement of personal bias was logical reasoning? Wtf?

get it now? i wasnt saying eqclassic is the best it can get, as in best game in the world.. geez...

btw, this is what REALLY went down

A) i luv brocolli, but ive already eatin it and allakazam.com had discovered every inch of it, so i dont want to eat it again
B) Oh come on, if I gave you broccoli you know you would eat it. its still the same broccoli u had before, and not everyone had eatin it all.
A) rahhhhr projecting kids ad hominem argue points not person make a point an back it up pete owns bob at soccro teh ubar rowr

That is quite possibly the worst analogy I have ever seen. Ever. You're comparing what you can "investigate" and "spoil" in a piece of food compared to what you can investigate in a game that was built around the very core of a vision that stated players should not have access to any extended amounts of information. Not to mention it's not the same brocolli at all. Not even remotely, because of all the client changes (but since your eyes will start glazing over when reading this sentence and jump to the next one that wouldn't shatter your faith, why do I bother?). And BTW, trying to dismiss the fact that you suck at arguing with a childish "I'm so cool this means nothing lol" doesn't work either.

p.s. im not trying to sound intelegent

Good. You're not.

, or trying to be a leet forum dude, or get respect, or penis envy, or like a master argueer, or like i know what im talking about, im just trying to tell people why an eq classic server is still worthwhile. This would go alot smoother on irc i think =)

Yeah, unfortunately, the only points you have stated so far are:

"Because."

and

"Because you suck."

You've provided nothing but personal bias and personal attacks on my own project throughout the entirety of this post. Your hint that I'm doing this to try to be a cool forum dood is pretty pathetic too. Let me just explain this as simple as possible. When you're trying to convince a person of an opposite stance, you need to provide plenty of reasoning - see my original post, and the amount of people who said it changed their views. If I had written as you, it would have been something like this:

"EQclassic doesn't work beacuse WR ROCKS man and you know it you know you want to play WR hahaha you're a freak and you KNOW that EQclassic sucks you KNOW it."

How many people would be convinced, do you think?

You get an F- on your test. And I'm still amazed at the stupidity of that analogy.

[Wiz]

Originally Posted by bbum

circle of elements is a full old world remake, including old world game mechanics, with custom content and quests and npcs text as well. so you shoudl help us

we got 97 reigstered useers on our forum at eqclassic.com and its only been up like a week! if even half of those peopel played that would be enought to make the server feel alive, old world is pretty damn small.

i think theres tons of people like me, who dont give a sh* about eq emu, or even the eqlive, but would still play a pre-kunark server, but maybe not =/

i think wiz should have a poll on his server about weather he should continue wr or a eq remake lol

You're seriously missing something here. The point of my entire original post is that there are plenty of people (myself included) who really loved pre-Kunark EQ, and wish for it back, but mistakenly think that it can be brought back.

If I made a poll like that, I'd probably get some people who'd want me to make an EQ classic remake (by sheer virtue of time investment already placed into WR alone most people wouldn't want it to change though), but 95% of these people would quit within a few weeks on a real EQ classic server.

I know you're stonewalling what everyone else is saying, but jeesh, at least misunderstand me in the right way.

[bbum]

Yeah, unfortunately, the only points you have stated so far are:

"Because."

and

"Because you suck."

your points is

1. pre -kunark wont be fun now because were not noobs and wont be getting lost in neriak..

2. there wont be enuf content on a pre-kunark server

whats my point is:

1. pre-kunark wasnt leet becasue we were noobs.

ive been on subject this whole time, it seems like your the one who keeps posting without a point, your not even talking about eq classic your just pwning me with your brain and giving me a scool lesson

Superiority through condenscating tone does not work. If anything, you're the one that is butchering your own language.

that was my point. i live in america, i dont know the language by the book like you.

+2 DEX is still like 0.1% proc rate. Try not to quote so incredibly selectively. Point not refuted.

what point?

Personal attack. WR is my project that is aiming towards my ideal image of EQ. It is far from complete. I refer you back to argumentative school, because you fail on the quiz.

thats not a personal attack, wr is just lame compared to real eq,s ry

No, killing a giant snake is not much of an accomplishment at all. It might be a decently useful lowbie item, but knowing what I know now, I could easily get 20 in a day on a Classic server that perfectly emulated EQclassic.

uhmmmmmmmmmmmm, no.

Quote:
you know the answer to all 3. i wont waste my time.


Yup, I do

really? so you know why pre-kunark is better than eqlive, why its more worthwhile to make a eq remake than try to make a new game, and why eq is better than any mmog since?

then wtf am i posting here still

So? It still wasn't logical, it was an appeal to nostalgia. I could apply that to anything, for example:

"We still haven't had a REAL milennia shift for four years, so I suggest we set back all calendars to 1999 again."

it was perfectly logical. you knew exactly what i ment when i said real everquest, so did everyone else who read the sentence, do i have to say pre-kunark for you to not be a bitch about it? no one gives a shit if i call it exept the few grammar nerd trolls

Yes, I did. And I backed up my point with a lot of logic that you have yet to refute. And the rest of the quote was ad hominems, so I think I did you a favor in taking it "out of context". You claimed a paragraph consisting of two ad hominems and a single statement of personal bias was logical reasoning? Wtf?

W_T_F?!?!?!? what do you want me to say!??! what point did you back up with logic?? i dont see a fucking point. all i said was a pre-kunark server now would be just as fun as pre-kunark then, unless you were a noob then and want to be a noob again for some reason, because then it wont work, but even so an old world server is the best it can get,

and then you quote the very last part, and make it sound llike i said a classic server is the best in the world. then you give me a lesson on how to back up my point . way to be a dick man.

[Wiz]

your not even reading my posts anymore, are you? im pretty sure you were that angry and were going to post that before you finsished the first sentence

Selective quoting, superiority claim and projecting, all in one.

Are you even trying anymore?

[bbum]

screw u lol, hell no im not trying, not trying to be leet anyway, all im trying to do is make peope think eq classic server isnt a bad idea..

this thread should be locked lol.. i mean.. what if made a thread called 'Winters Roar - and why it doesnt work"

of course the thread would be stupid, becasue theres no reason wr cant work, it just has very limited appeal (who would want to play norrath jr. besides people banned from eq or broke peopel with no other choice?)

[Wiz]

Originally Posted by bbum

screw u lol, hell no im not trying, not trying to be leet anyway, all im trying to do is make peope think eq classic server isnt a bad idea..

this thread should be locked lol.. i mean.. what if made a thread called 'Winters Roar - and why it doesnt work"

of course the thread would be stupid, becasue theres no reason wr cant work, it just has very limited appeal (who would want to play norrath jr. besides people banned from eq or broke peopel with no other choice?)

Go ahead. Unfortunately, you wouldn't actually be able to convince people, because you seem rather incapable of stating anything that isn't a blind belief.

I'll settle with solid logic and proven points. Or as you call it, "being leet".

[bbum]

you seem rather incapable of stating anything that isn't a blind belief.

dude cmon, your just being an ass in the last few posts lol

what blind belief do i believe in???//?//?

[Wiz]

Originally Posted by bbum

dude cmon, your just being an ass in the last few posts lol

what blind belief do i believe in???//?//?

No, I'm not just being an ass. I'm pointing out that you haven't provided any backing whatsoever for your opinion of EQclassic, and has failed to refute any of the points originally made. If you claim something but can't back it up with reasoning, it becomes a belief.

That's all.

[Wiz]

your points is

1. pre -kunark wont be fun now because were not noobs and wont be getting lost in neriak..

2. there wont be enuf content on a pre-kunark server

whats my point is:

1. pre-kunark wasnt leet becasue we were noobs.

ive been on subject this whole time, it seems like your the one who keeps posting without a point, your not even talking about eq classic your just pwning me with your brain and giving me a scool lesson

Okay. Now here's the thing. I've backed up my stance on pre-kunark, and lots of people on this thread has agreed with me that the most fun thing about pre-kunark was the fact that you just didn't know.

You have stated that pre-kunark content was amazing and awesome and delicious, without actually explaining what was so good about it.

what point?

That +2 DEX rings will not have people all excited now that they know how useless 2 DEX actually is.

uhmmmmmmmmmmmm, no.

Yup. Towards the end of classic, before kunark, I got a character to level 20 (necro) without twinkage or PLing in about 18 hours of play. It's not hard when you know the right spots.

really? so you know why pre-kunark is better than eqlive, why its more worthwhile to make a eq remake than try to make a new game, and why eq is better than any mmog since?

then wtf am i posting here still

This calls for a snicker.

it was perfectly logical. you knew exactly what i ment when i said real everquest, so did everyone else who read the sentence, do i have to say pre-kunark for you to not be a bitch about it? no one gives a shit if i call it exept the few grammar nerd trolls

No see, the point wasn't what you meant. I understood what you meant, even if it's poor practice to use jargon that might mean different things to different people. It just wasn't a logical point (which was what I originally asked for, then you replied "I have said logical things:" and quoted that), because it was all emotion and personal bias.

W_T_F?!?!?!? what do you want me to say!??! what point did you back up with logic?? i dont see a fucking point. all i said was a pre-kunark server now would be just as fun as pre-kunark then, unless you were a noob then and want to be a noob again for some reason, because then it wont work, but even so an old world server is the best it can get,

and then you quote the very last part, and make it sound llike i said a classic server is the best in the world. then you give me a lesson on how to back up my point . way to be a dick man.

Go re-read the initial post. I backed up my points rather well. If you want to point out any logical fallacies in my reasoning, do so, instead of yelling generic insults.

Unless you missed it, cleverboy, YOU were the one that quoted the section I picked apart. I was replying to your claim that it was a logical point. Way to insult yourself. You didn't say "unless", you said "because". There's a huge difference there.

You seem to be getting rather riled up.

[Melwin2]

This thread is the reason the EQEmu forums have existed to this point.

Once it dies down, you can close them.

[bbum]

If you want to point out any logical fallacies in my reasoning, do so, instead of yelling generic insults.

and then you quote the very last part, and make it sound llike i said a classic server is the best in the world. then you give me a lesson on how to back up my point . way to be a dick man.

done.

Unless you missed it, cleverboy, YOU were the one that quoted the section I picked apart. I was replying to your claim that it was a logical point. Way to insult yourself. You didn't say "unless", you said "because". There's a huge difference there.

wait what, i dont get this sentence? where did i say unless instead of because?

[Wiz]

and then you quote the very last part, and make it sound llike i said a classic server is the best in the world. then you give me a lesson on how to back up my point . way to be a dick man.

Yawn. Of course, it was about pointing out logical fallacies in the overlying argument, but let's look at this.

You quoted as logic:

if they brought back the old game just like it was back then, why wouldnt it be as fun? ok its opinion and maybe it wouldnt be as fun for you beccause your a freak and eq was your first mmog and you want to be a newbie again or something.. but playing on an old world server, with old world gameplay and content and mechanics is the best it can freaking get.

I replied by slicing it up to point out why this wasn't logical at all.

Oh for fucks sakes, MORE unbased promotion? I believe we already covered this in the argumentative school.

I see no logical fallacy here. You did use unbased promotion.

wait what, i dont get this sentence? where did i say unless instead of because?

You said:

if they brought back the old game just like it was back then, why wouldnt it be as fun? ok its opinion and maybe it wouldnt be as fun for you beccause your a freak and eq was your first mmog and you want to be a newbie again or something. but playing on an old world server, with old world gameplay and content and mechanics is the best it can freaking get.

Direct attrition.

You then said:

W_T_F?!?!?!? what do you want me to say!??! what point did you back up with logic?? i dont see a fucking point. all i said was a pre-kunark server now would be just as fun as pre-kunark then, unless you were a noob then and want to be a noob again for some reason, because then it wont work, but even so an old world server is the best it can get,

I assumed you didn't just drift off completely and start talking about your general consensus. I guess that was wrong.

[bbum]

what? lol


someone put this in dumbass terms for me